TWiT 1070: A Yacht for Your Yacht - Super Bowl LX Gets a Surge of AI Ads!

[00:00:00] It's time for TWIT This Week in Tech. It's the LLM episode. No, not AI. It's Larry, Lou, and Mike. Larry Magid, Lou Mareska, and Mike Elgin, plus me, another L, will be talking about AI and how much the hyperscalers are spending. This year, almost a trillion dollars to build out data centers. Data centers in space! What could possibly go wrong? And why McDonald's doesn't want you to use their products for your passwords.

[00:00:28] All that and more coming up on TWIT. Podcasts you love. From people you trust. This is TWIT. This is TWIT. This Week in Tech, episode 1070, recorded Sunday, February 8th, 2026. A Yacht for Your Yacht.

[00:00:56] It's time for TWIT This Week in Tech, the show where we cover the week's tech news. Hello, everybody. If you're watching live, yeah, we started a little bit early because I guess there's a sporting event. Oh, yeah. The Winter Olympics later today. No. The Super Bowl later today. That's hence my outfit I'm wearing. Well, we decided with AI that everybody could be wearing their favorite outfit, right?

[00:01:20] I'm wearing my Niners gear. I don't know what Larry's wearing in this AI-aided picture, Benito. Do you have it there? I'm wearing a shirt with a big moray pattern design. No, no. Aaron Rodgers. You look like a Patriots guy. A Patriots guy. Oh, no. Mike Elkin's a Steelers fan. And I don't know why they made Lou Mareska, who doesn't even look like Lou Mareska, an Eagles fan. Oh, Jets, it says. I look like Aaron Rodgers there. You look, you know what? They put a little Aaron Rodgers on you.

[00:01:48] Lou Mareska is here. He is an AI engineering lead, a co-pilot at Microsoft. So nice to see you, Lou. Actually, you look like Aaron Rodgers, but a nice Aaron Rodgers. A sane Aaron Rodgers. Thank you. Sane. There you go. So nice to see Lou. Mike Elkin is in Oaxaca, Mexico. He is always welcome here, gastronomad.net. And he writes about AI at machinesociety.ai, his newsletter. Great to see you, Mike. That's right. I'm wearing the colors of UC Santa Cruz, the fighting banana slugs.

[00:02:18] I didn't go there, but I like slugs. My wife, my dad, I'll tell her about that. Yeah, my dad taught there. So I'm a banana slug. That's right. Well, I'm not, but I could be. And Larry Maggett from ConnectSafely.org, where he is the president and CEO, keeping kids safe online. Happy Safer Internet Day, Larry. Well, thank you. That comes up on Tuesday. And you can watch our webinar. And if you're in Sacramento, you can come to our event.

[00:02:46] And if you happen to live in one of the 20 cities where we're having local events, you can catch one of those. And these are aimed at parents of children online? It's aimed at parents. It's aimed at teens. We're working a lot with teens. And we're having an event in Sacramento with a bunch of high school and college kids and a couple of elected officials and execs from OpenAI, Google, Meta, Discord, Amazon, you know, a few other companies. Some would say that's the enemy. It's saying, you know what, we have deliberately put people on the panel who will probably say that.

[00:03:16] It's going to be a very contentious conversation because we chose to put some young people, interestingly enough, young people who are very concerned about the dangers of social media, not grownups like me, but kids who are saying, you know, I thought it was going to be really cool. But now that I'm getting to be 16, 17, I'm starting to rethink it. So they're going to be on the panel with some of these tech execs. I don't know. I'd like to know what you guys think.

[00:03:42] But my latest thinking, because I go back and forth and all this, my latest thinking is social media is great. It is an opportunity for kids to meet kids from all over the world, to have a social group, especially kids who are otherwise marginalized because they're gay or trans or fat or weird or whatever, or geeks like a lot of us. And so it's good in that regard.

[00:04:07] Where it went wrong is where these big tech companies decided, well, we want to really make it sticky. And they turned algorithms on. If Instagram were as it was in the early days, just my friends and their pictures, I don't think it would be so bad. I know there's still the opportunity for somebody to follow models and say, oh, my body is not good and that kind of thing. But that would be something they would choose instead of being thrust upon them. Right. Do you agree?

[00:04:36] You have kids in that age group, Lou. What are you doing with your kids? Yeah, I mean, I've come to the truth that you can't keep AI or technology or social networks away from kids. You might not want to, because don't they need to know how it works and how to defend themselves? It's all about literacy, right? It's all about understanding the limits and what you should and shouldn't be doing with it. And so that's what I've been doing. Yeah. And that's why we're in business. That's basically what we do. Yeah. You guys have a great contract to it, connect safely.org. Oh, thank you. That parents can sign with their kids. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:05:06] So that, you know, you can explicitly say, well, here's our, you know, our rules. Yeah. I love all the stuff that- I agree with you both. I mean, I think that, first of all, if you're growing up today and you're not learning AI, you're denying yourself an incredible skill that you need to have. Like it or love it or hate it. Right. It's essential for the future. And, you know, the other problem with social, if you don't let kids use social media, they're going to, at some point when they're 18 and the parents are no longer controlled, they're going to do something probably more dangerous.

[00:05:36] And I always like to say, you know, you're a kid for 18 years. You're in a grown up for who knows how long, a long time, hopefully. And so we have to prepare for kids. I love the stuff that- Yeah, I love the stuff Larry does because basically parents are kind of on their own in a world where all their kids' friends are doing certain things using phones, all the rest.

[00:05:54] And to have guidelines, to have agreed upon norms that parents can accept and share with their friends, that's the only way forward other than school bans. You know, one of the things, I was worried that as people who were digital natives became parents, which is currently the case, that we would be put out of business because they wouldn't need us. But surprisingly, we find we get a lot of good feedback from young parents.

[00:06:20] You know, your parents in their 20s and 30s and early 40s, they grew up with technology, but technology is changing so rapidly that even the tech natives are having to readjust constantly to what's happening. Again, especially with AI. We wrote the parents guide for AI for all of the three major AI players. And, you know, that's stuff that's very much in demand among young parents. Larry and Leo and Lou, I got a new buzzword for you.

[00:06:50] This is going to be the buzzword for the rest of the decade. We've all heard about the old buzzword, which is the attention economy. That's what we're talking about, where the attention economy began in the 50s with TV commercials, went through. It was described well in 1971. And then it became that phrase came into use in the 1990s. And the idea is that human attention is a limited commodity that can be commoditized, bought and sold.

[00:07:15] And as the amount of content grows exponentially, the amount of human attention stays the same. And so there's been this massive contest for limited human attention. And that's the attention economy. That's what divides our politics. That's what makes people addicted to social media and all the rest. The buzzword that's coming is the attachment economy because AI is going to take attention to another level by making some people fall in love with checklists.

[00:07:45] Chatbots, for example. Humanoid robots that people respond in their brain chemistry as if they're people. People having the delusion that AI and robots and robotic pets that are run by AI actually have an inner life, have feelings, have all that kind of stuff. And so the attachment economy is the next step of the attention economy. I even am launching a sub stack about this and I'm going to be writing a lot about the attachment economy.

[00:08:09] But this is the risk. And again, like you say, Leo, the potential for social media is fantastic. It's a lifesaver for some people. And the potential for AI is the same thing. It's a massive upside for people who use it well, people use it right. For the general public, however, these Silicon Valley companies are going to weaponize AI to make people feel emotionally attached to their products. They're already doing that, aren't they? It's already doing it.

[00:08:39] Mike, how does that play in with the agency when these bots are actually agents? Instead of having to pay attention, they're actually doing it for you, right? They're booking your travel. They're booking your restaurant. They're doing your taxes, whatever it is. We used to look at them for information so we could do ourselves. They're doing for us. What does that mean? Well, it's giving us brain rot and all the rest. But we're in an intermediate phase right now. Yeah, but you could say GPS in your car is giving you brain rot too. I mean, I know I know.

[00:09:07] Well, it does. Kids have no idea how to use a map. Do they need to? Who knows? There's even a case to be made that digital clocks give kids brain rot because they can't read analog clocks. I don't quite agree with that. Right. What do you think? I mean, Lou's an AI guy. Lou's designing AI for... You're more for enterprise, right? I think the idea with agents is you just got to build agents without turning basically human loneliness into the business model of the decade, I think. I think that's really the whole key.

[00:09:37] And I think that's what we try to do is we try to make sure that they're helpful. But... Yeah, enterprise bots are not sycophantic. They do not fall in love with you, right? They're not. Because that's not what enterprise wants, right? If you're using Copilot and Excel, you don't want to say, hey, great idea! Yeah, really. You're so smart! I have to say, you're doing some vibe coding, aren't you, Lou? Oh yeah, all the time. I do it every day. Yep. Yeah, whether it's for work or for home. And we're...

[00:10:05] I mean, you're a professional coder. I'm a hobbyist coder. I still love coding, but there's so many... There's the old adage that sysadmins have. If you do something more than three times, you should write a script to do it, right? That's right. But that is always a difficult challenge. Like, am I going to do it a fifth time? Am I going to... Is it going to take me more time to write the script and to do it a hundred times? Do I really want... Right. Yeah. And now it's like, no, no, just automate it. Because it's so easy to tell, you know, especially Claude Code. Oh yeah. I love Claude Code.

[00:10:35] I apologize to Copilot. No, no. We love Claude Code. Use it every day. Something happened at Anthropic. Yeah. It just blew up. And I think it's all about tooling and making things easier for people, bringing it downstream. Yeah. But now they released this week... Well, we'll get to the AI section. I want to keep with the social media briefly because it is Safer Internet Day on Tuesday. More schools... From Fast Company, more schools are banning phones so students can focus.

[00:11:02] It's actually now 29 states have passed laws that require K through 12 public schools to ban or limit students using cell phones on campus. Another 10 states require local school districts to take some kind of action. 77% of public schools forbid... 77% in the United States forbids students from having their phones out during class. 78% XL велic. And this, you know, I always... We have scientific method for a reason.

[00:11:32] When you hear people say well, that makes sense. Seems... Always my hairs go up in the back of my neck. Because it might make sense. But what... What does the science say? Ohio, which has clamped down over a student's cell phone usage over the last 18 months. in fact they have the strict one of the strictest cell phone use policies as of last year

[00:11:58] from this fast company article in the fall of 25 i surveyed 13 ohio public school principals 62 described more verbal face-to-face socializing somebody somebody said one school administrator said it used to be really quiet at lunch and now you can hear kids talking again right they used to be just like this 68 notice the students can stay on one task for more than 20 minutes without

[00:12:23] seeking a quick digital break it's like the smokers you know i can't i gotta take a break man uh 72 observed a shift from heads down scrolling to active conversation 61 fewer online social conflicts spilling over into the real world even students i think are saying yeah yeah this this i feel better about this so maybe these bands what do you think i think these bands are also

[00:12:52] under the same yeah as long as everybody's equal exactly yeah i was against him at first i mean i wrote various articles you know saying i said there were a bad idea but i'm beginning to rethink it i mean you just did all the things you're saying and also talking to connect safely student advisory council talking to the kids that i work with and surprisingly some of them are happy with it just like surprisingly to me although now that what you're saying i think other we're beginning to

[00:13:19] see that maybe it was a good idea i mean so now the next step is to what australia has done they've banned under 16s completely from social media france spain malaysia denmark all considering barring young people from facebook tiktok australia even bans them from youtube um not a fan of that plan yeah well one of our one of our concerns is as uh technologists is that that means you're going to

[00:13:46] have to have some sort of age age verification which is inherently privacy uh and problematic with privacy it also keeps kids i mean look you know if you're 16 or 15 years old and you mentioned you might be gay your parents might be homophobic uh then you know you might need this outlet this ability to reach out beyond your narrow little world that you live in in whatever community you're in

[00:14:13] and i the other thing is you know we can talk about the problems and there are many but millions of kids use it every day very productively uh they're not having serious problems and we have to consider the fact that all technologies have a risk i mean they're you know you get in the car you know you're taking a risk i'm not saying that we shouldn't have regulations but i do question whether we should keep teenagers away from social media it seems to me that yeah we should put

[00:14:40] pressure on the companies to make them as safe as possible and as lou and i've that's what the eu is doing they've told tiktok you have to disable addictive features like infinite scroll right well this is this is getting closer to the heart of the problem the problem isn't social media the problem isn't being able to talk to people over the world uh on topics that are very particularly important to you as an individual the problem are the algorithms and the and the constant race

[00:15:08] to have the most addictive algorithms tiktok is by far the winner now because their algorithms will just show you young people just swipe swipe swipe you look around in here in oaxaca and all over the world wherever we travel that you walk to see the police uh standing there looking at their phones and you go up and look at their phones and they're on tiktok right did you it's lisa can't get away from it yesterday lisa was sitting behind a police car at a light the light went green the police car

[00:15:34] didn't move because the officer was on his phone and and now she did something i would never have done she honked and waved come on and he looked at her but he you know he didn't write a ticket he he moved because he knew he shouldn't have been doing doing that um so i know so one this is the trial that's going on in la right now right you know this is this is the big trial going on with uh with all the

[00:16:01] big social although snap uh and i think tiktok settled before the trial but youtube and facebook and instagram are in there and the whole premise of it is the lawyers are gearing up to argue that the companies behind these platforms are designing their sites to be deliberately addictive now i don't buy the internet addiction thing uh yeah it's it's not heroin it's not even cigarettes

[00:16:28] it's not addiction it's more like chocolate in my opinion it's more like chocolate yeah that's fair it's yeah chocolate can be deadly chocolate but we don't ban chocolate yeah we expect people to have some restraint there you go exactly it's it's more like mcdonald's because mcdonald's fast food is engineered it is to bypass your your your self-control because of the salt and the way

[00:16:56] they do the umami and all that stuff it's engineered to make it irresistible and they put sugar the mcdonald's put sugars in almost every single thing including the buns in everything buns yeah and so and so that's the problem it's the deliberate engineering to bypass your reason and go straight for your sort of mental uranus hard wiring that needs certain types of stimulation it's basically we're trying to patch the attention and attachment uh economy at the edge like we're trying to make

[00:17:24] things better um and i think it's all about like you said it's all about making sure you just you know you make awareness you give awareness to people rather than trying to manage it there the other thing you know section 230 when it was written in 1996 this is happy by the way yeah happy anniversary section 230 now 30 years old well and it's getting a little old getting getting a little gray not that i should complain but you know when it was written it was during the days of all compu serve prodigy

[00:17:53] they didn't have algorithms i don't recall aol you know sort of figuring out what i wanted and putting me into a forum or whatever it had and so at the time they really were just forums and not publishers but i would argue that if they're feeding you an algorithm isn't that being a publisher isn't that like the new york times what to put on the front page agree with you 100 larry that's exactly right those are editorial decisions albeit in software and very complex yeah but they are deciding what's

[00:18:23] important what isn't important and that's very different from like i follow 100 people and i get everything those 100 people say right and some of them are not they're deciding what i see and if there's a nutcase among them and you and they they defame you you sue them you don't sue yes compu service right it still existed but again it's different with these uh social media companies all right and it's not static these things are always evolving to become more compelling and so we stay the

[00:18:51] same but the algorithms that attract us uh in this attention economy right i just keep getting better and better and better and everything's been tick tockified because that's the model that worked best so you go to instagram or any even facebook's got reels down like network i can't get away from those facebook reels and they are so clever and the meta thing where they know all my interests and they they suck me in with whatever i have a two pound box of seized candies down in the pantry but i resist

[00:19:20] going in there and having another chocolate it's hard um i ended up taking instagram and tick tock off of my phones i took tick tock off when the when it became the u.s version of tick tock and they had the new the new requirements that you know that said uh and if we're going to reveal your immigration status if we know it so don't you know and uh i thought you know this is it's time i love tick tock but i'll

[00:19:44] find something else to do uh you know for breakfast but uh i did take them off imagine if that box of chocolates was always changing all every day changing to become more and there was a little pop up on my screen you can resist it today it said there's a dark chocolate bordeaux with your because your name on it would you like to would you like to that's right yeah yeah yeah here waving in front of my face like i like chocolate with my coffee but what if every time i picked up a cup of coffee a

[00:20:12] chocolate would pop into my onto my plate can we can we vibe code that well we could if you can did you have you played we're going to talk about ai a little bit because we got that we got the ai expert here uh lou mareska uh and we will uh do that next i'm just curious have you played with open claw at all have you thought about it lou have i oh yeah absolutely have you set it up

[00:20:37] yeah yeah absolutely despite the you know i set it up over here i said okay i'm going to create a new account my mac mini i'm going to be very judicious but i did but but it doesn't matter you could put it on a vps you could put it in sandbox but you still have to give it your credentials if you got to give it do anything right so i sat down and i gave it all of my uh google gmail and google docs calendar address book and then in the middle of the night i woke up in a cold sweat and i ran upstairs

[00:21:05] and i deleted the whole the whole account i have it running do you have it running i do it i'm running back there at that machine and it's all it's all isolated to accounts that i don't use mainstream so it doesn't have like my access to my direct calendar so it doesn't do anything useful it there's a mirror or a shadow of on there you know so i tried to kind of leak information to it that can maybe be useful to it but i try not to give it everything it's so cool the the whole idea of

[00:21:36] uh and this is what i've always wanted this is i hope where we're headed in fact a number of people have said on our shows this 2026 will be a year of personal agents yeah yeah the whole idea of an ai agent who knows you understands you knows a lot about your preferences your interests has access to your data and can because it's running 24 7 start doing stuff for you there you mentioned that but i don't want to call the restaurant make reservations i'm not that's not taking away some of my agency

[00:22:05] why would i want to spend time doing that i want to say to my little buddy hey uh hey you know fido make me a reservation for tonight my favorite restaurant and and if you can't then get the second best but what if it makes you a plane where this is the attachment economy we're going to like and have affection for our personal agents i already do this is actually that's what scared what if it makes you a non-refundable airline trip that you actually don't want to take i mean

[00:22:31] well then i have veto power then it screwed me yeah well you i mean lou you could set it up so it doesn't do that i was going to give it a credit card with a five dollar limit i wanted it to have some money like an allowance but not and i don't want it to do that i think you can set constraints although policies and constraints to it yeah and will it obey them yeah absolutely yeah i mean you can make them non like walls of china walls right basically don't go beyond

[00:23:00] this right don't go beyond make a plane reservation for me without first asking me right well the plane reservation is my favorite example of what could go wrong so for example you could have you could tell your agents who go book me an airline ticket and then it goes and realizes that um all the all the seats are taken right and so it it basically hire somebody to hack the airline to get the names and addresses of

[00:23:27] everybody who's already got a seat and then hires an assassin to go kill two of them because you told it you wanted to see it on that airline and uh this is the stuff of sci-fi of course but and this is this is not likely but things are going to go wrong uh with uh with part of this this stuff as what i'm talking about of course is this sort of the task rabbit called rent a human dot ai right that is designed to work with agentic ai generally but but especially you assume your task rabbit has enough judgment not

[00:23:54] to hire a killer but but there's no judgment involved in this thing was vibe coded i don't think there's any guard rails built in don't assume that don't assume it give it the directions like i mean the problem is as long as it doesn't hallucinate like if it follows if it really is limited by constraints that i give it i mean the constraints you're giving it are in a markdown file lou yeah it's not like

[00:24:21] it's not like chains i mean it's as long as you know that it will not do what you say not to do right i mean you got to be explicit just like every company nowadays assume that you have breached assume you have people breaking into your network like assume that the ai is going to do bad things yeah do zero trust yeah all right well we'll talk a little more about ai we got some great people on here it's great to have you lou mareska he is engineering lead at copilot uh at at that a

[00:24:45] little company up in redmond called microsoft part of it good to see you also i presume a patriots fan although since you were in seattle i know i'm torn i'm torn i love them both what are you gonna know it's tough can i tell you how much my heart hurts to see the field at levi's stadium and it says seahawks at one end and patriots at the other end can i tell you how much that breaks

[00:25:10] my heart imagine going to gillette and seeing uh you know 49ers and seahawks or something there you would be a happy that's sad anyway uh we're doing the show a little bit early so that we can get out of the way and let you watch the super bowl appreciate that i i appreciate my wife's watching the olympics by the way instead of the super bowl yeah you know who who scheduled those at the same

[00:25:33] time i don't know i mean you can't have snoop dog at both i don't weren't they thinking weren't they thinking they could have put the winter olympics in the summer time that would have gotten it out of the way that people just one dog mike elgin is also here from mohaka always great to see you machine society.a do you know yet what your attachment uh blog will be or newsletter the

[00:25:58] attachment economy dot subs dot com for now and then it'll convert over to the attachment economy.com good in a couple of days i like that thought i can't wait to read more about that on the show i think i think i'm already i've been writing about those that theme for a long time i know i'm attached uh i've been i call it clod pilled because uh yeah on intelligent machines

[00:26:24] better than grok sucker yeah i'm a grok sucker uh or i'm a clanker well you know it's funny about when i talk to my ai like in the car i will talk to ai and i find myself developing a much more attached relationship than when i'm typing at it that's why they do the chatbots that's precise i don't want to hear a voice but i gotta tell you my claude my my claude calls me skipper and skip and how cute

[00:26:50] and i can't you know and you know what's driving me crazy is i don't i'll make the a word that comes from amazon i don't want to say the word because i don't want to trigger everybody's device yeah but it's gotten so chatty and it won't shut up and and you ask it a simple question you say you know how old is somebody and they get their entire biography and i'll say no if i wanted to know their entire work i would have i find myself yelling at it all the time yeah and i'm thinking about i don't know

[00:27:15] if i can go back to the old a word but if i can i i actually liked it better i don't like uh a word plus very much the new smart a word and actually there was a rumor that they're going to use uh another model i think it was open ai's chat gpt instead so i would prefer that because yeah chat gpt isn't as as chatty it's not as obnoxious not quite it's going it's very obnoxious you're right yeah yeah

[00:27:42] yeah and it's also um and i think this is part of amazon's and shittification it's also always saying hey did you know i could do this would you like to know more right exactly well i use the right routine i use it to write routines which are really you know a word routines which are very handy because i can just say what i want and it doesn't but it always wants to explain to me what a routine is and how they operate and i've had it so write so many routines that i'd have to be a complete idiot by

[00:28:08] this time not to know what a routine is but it just insists on educating me each time i ask it to do a task yeah i don't like that i think that's part of the uh uh attention economy not the attachment that's larry maggot it is uh internet uh safety safer internet day on tuesday celebrate with him at connect safely.org and mike elgin uh i didn't mention of course machine society.ai we'll get

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[00:32:55] passwords anymore for ssh but warden will generate a uh a uh a password combo you know you have a public key and a private key combo i use elliptic curve cryptography what is it e 2996 whatever it is and it'll generate that store it and then deliver it the the key the public key when i log on to ssh it handles the whole process so that is that that private key which you really have to keep secret

[00:33:25] is never exposed it's always in the bit warden vault things like that make you what if i just wanted to throw like my social security number or other well i do that yes i have my social that you can do that within bit warden now yeah just as a note that's not that is no yeah i have my passport my driver's license and because i always carry this is not part of the head because i always carry my uh phone with me which has bitwarden on it or other devices i always have access to an image of my passport so

[00:33:51] if i'm traveling and i lose my passport i i at least have a secure way of showing them what my passport was and all that stuff same thing with driver's license no i think that that's a that's a good thing to have it that's why like that's why by the way i support it being open source because you can verify that it it uses strong crypto you know well-known established crypto routines that it has no back doors all that stuff uh and then once you know this is trustworthy reproducible

[00:34:19] builds all that stuff once you know it's trustworthy then you can store stuff in it and it's fully encrypted strong encryption so nobody can get out i think that's a yeah i i absolutely recommend everybody uh do that i'll try the way yeah and i'm sure you you address that all the time lou uh you know your your api keys your api secrets how many times have we seen aws exactly published right yeah we have special tools that actually scan the code now tell you if they see them in there and we say

[00:34:49] stick it in a key vault stick in a key vault i think i uh i regularly do a security audit with a cloud code and it's claude has clearly been informed because it says you know you're you put your did you know you put your api keys in your obsidian vault that's clear text it's what do you do with with documents that need to be need to be secure um same thing cryptic stick in the key vault

[00:35:15] i what i do basically uh is i have a sync thing instance running that synchronizes a special folder and that folder is encrypted and it synchronizes that and i can decrypt it on everywhere but it is never at any and sync things encrypted and it doesn't go out to the cloud ever so i feel fairly safe that not only they have multiple copies of those important secrets but because they're encrypted there uh even if somebody got on my machine you know they would have to know the password that kind

[00:35:42] of thing i think it's possible to do that or use a i have yubi keys you know use yubi key to unlock this yeah but i have a thumb drive that it's like the you know the the biometrics on it yeah that encrypts everything yeah yeah perfect yeah uh all right let's talk about uh what happened this week anthropic updated opus from four five to four six four five was already like that came out in november two months later now they've updated that 20 minutes later open ai

[00:36:11] updated chat gbt to five three we are in and if you watch super bowl ads uh tonight this afternoon you will see a this is like coke and pepsi right it is and that's a good thing right lou i agree it's good i think it's great i think it's pushing things forward fast you know it's interesting though they've not gone they're not gone at each other yet oh wait a minute you haven't seen anthropics uh super bowl ad well i haven't let's be interesting and sam altman's pissed

[00:36:42] uh so i'll just give you the uh i don't want to spoil it for you but you remember you've seen the the chat gpt ads where some kid gets strong because he had chat gpt write a exercise routine for him it shows you on the text so anthropics ad has a kid doing pull-ups and and uh and it has the chat gpt chat bot which is this buff guy say yeah let me give you a routine

[00:37:06] and then he does an ad and this is because chat gpt open ai has said we're going to put ads in chat gpt sam alman says anthropic knows perfectly well first of all anthropic responded dario mode said we're never going to put ads in uh in claude and then sam altman goes we're they know perfectly well we don't do that we're not giving you our recommendations are not ads it's it's it's below the fold it's just it's

[00:37:32] just a little tiny and so sam's yes no they're fighting in the super bowl ads yeah it's funny i watched a couple of those commercials they were hysterical but you know the thing is that google for example has always separated sponsored uh results from organic research and i think that's what chat gpt is but if you go into google now that first of all there are more of them and they're a little it's a little easy to accidentally click on one of those sponsored results i have done it and i know people all the time who who say oh google showed me this and

[00:38:01] now but for some reason it took me to some competitor and say yeah look for the word sponsored in teeny teeny type so i think people can still be fooled i don't know what i'm not saying open ai is going to fool people but i think even with a disclosure there's a risk clearly enough i agree people can be fooled into thinking it's organic mike elgin knows i stopped using google and i pay 25 bucks a month for coggy uh which gives me equivalently good search results mostly because

[00:38:27] they're from google a lot of them are from google uh but without any ads and without any bias mike's son works at coggy so he has a little bit of what i do to eliminate so i i was doing a search for connect for safer internet day to see how connect safely was doing in the results and when i just did it out of my own version of my browser of course we came out really really well and then i said wait a minute i did a vpn and i did an incognito window to do the same search and we still did well we still

[00:38:54] did very well but not as well as when google knows it knows who you are yeah it's oh larry i bet you'd like to see your own site more exactly yeah yeah yeah and incognito as we all know because google lost a big lawsuit it's not that incognito anyway um yeah so coggy coggy's uh i think uh doing the work of

[00:39:18] the angels they're a uh they're public a public benefit company right mike yeah yeah they are public benefit corporation that's what they are that's and and so yeah the thing that i like about it one of the things i like about it is the fact that i can try as a journalist i can try all the models through coggy assistant there's just a wall of models old versions new versions take your pick try them out uh compare them i replaced perplexity with it because i think it's better than perplexity to be

[00:39:45] honest cool so did i yeah yeah so did i and it's the same it's the same notion which is it's orchestrating a variety of different ais uh but i use coggy all the time now and the way i use perplexity uh how do you spell it yeah kagi.com okay uh and the coggy assistant is uh is fantastic they're a paid search engine and if you and i have them as my default search engine in my browser me too and if you have

[00:40:10] to jump through hoops by the way nobody wants to let you do that right the browsers don't want to let you do that right yeah but uh it's not that hard you you can do it and and then when i ask a query in the in the address bar and add a question mark at the end the question mark tells coggy search that you want a little ai summary of the results yeah it doesn't do the thing google does which automatically stick in that ai stuff you don't you have to ask for here's the assistant and just the

[00:40:38] models you you know it it it has the latest like the new kimmy k2 it has glm 47 which just came out doesn't have four six yet it's opus four five but if i scroll down it goes oh yeah there it does it has open for six sorry you it's just a little lower that has reasoning it has all of the doesn't have five three yet for open ai chat gpt so if you subscribe can you cancel your 20 a month or whatever

[00:41:06] you're paying to the individual ai things and we'll take care of it or do you have to still pay it's a different kind of thing yes i would say if if what you use the ais for is search yes but but that 20 a month can also do vibe coding you can do other things uh i'm embarrassed to admit that after i played with claude code for a while i ended up buying claude max because i want all the tokens

[00:41:31] i'm sure i'm sure you you probably as a microsoft employee get access to uh unlimited tokens right uh no i wouldn't say that no no no we have challenges a lot sometimes yeah well because you see one of the things people do now with these vibe coders is they'll spin up five or six of them and then each of them will spit up more sub agents that something was added for six here's an interest i thought a

[00:41:55] very interesting result in uh in claude i mean uh yeah opus four six they were able to find 500 zero days in open source code they set all of all of the companies now do things like this they they anthropic said let's take claude opus 4 6 the new model before the debut they their the anthropics

[00:42:21] frontier red team put it in a sandboxed environment gave claude model everything he needed to do the job access to python vulnerability analysis tools debuggers fuzzers no specific instructions or specialized knowledge claude found more than 500 verifiable previously unknown zero day vulnerabilities

[00:42:45] that's now on the one hand you go that's fantastic on the other hand just think hackers also have access to these tools and they're probably doing the same thing you know what drives me nuts about the new models though is all these services including perplexity they they charge extra for the new models that come in they'll say you have to upgrade but like for instance opus 4 5 and 4 6 they're

[00:43:11] exactly the same cost like to cost the api their tokens everything's exactly the same but you have to pay extra to use it it's all about getting the newest model sooner so so when services do that i step away from it yeah and the thing is google microsoft amazon apple all these companies have other revenue streams open ai and anthropic you know they're spending the investors money they really are desperate to have some sort of revenue stream that's why open ai is doing ads that's why anthropic's saying

[00:43:39] they have also a fast mode that you can turn on for four six that makes it faster but consumes tokens at what was it six times the rate well the reason why that is though it's they don't they don't do the reasoning part of it they actually shove everything in the context window so that you have all the context there and then the model does reasons on that which just makes it faster yeah yeah uh four

[00:44:02] six has a one million uh token context uh window which is pretty big pretty pretty big it means you could dump a lot of documents in bigger memory lots more memory yeah yeah um anything else you want to say about ai before we move on i think we've said it all blue you're you so wow i'm amazed you're

[00:44:31] using open claw uh oh yeah you're trying to use everything you know i keep up on it changes so often you know it's just amazing that's the that's what's a little scary i think for everybody uh on the frontier of this stuff is it's moving so fast you know i used to say i used to say that ai is sort of a the equivalent of the world wide web or broadband or the iphone but i i now think it's the equivalent

[00:44:54] of electricity it is such a fundamental change uh compared to anything i've seen in my 40 years as a technology journalist i i really don't want to over hype it oversell it um i'm very cautious about that but as a user i'm blown away every single day and it's hard for me i think like i said i'm

[00:45:15] i got claude pilled and uh i i i think i'm maybe need to get some objectivity on this and i was hoping to get some but you guys are helping us it is something happened so lou i'm curious if lou i'm curious if you use moltbook you know notebook lm i don't i don't use that no no no no molt molt

[00:45:39] moltbook the facebook for ai agents no i do not use that no no no no so where do we stand on the controversy because there's a lot of uh evidence that most of it is just made out of people basically and well even if it's not if you go it's just a toy i mean it's it's it what it is is a in theory is a bunch of uh clawed open client instances talking to one another right and having existential dramas and

[00:46:06] maybe there's a lot is it really that i don't think it really is that so if you go to the actual reddit they say it's based on reddit because the the agents can vote up or vote down comments and and post but on the real reddit some two-digit percentage of the posts there are ai-jated and two-digit percentage of the because people are just copying pasting from chat gbt or whatever and pasting it into reddit and so that's a problem on reddit and that's basically what moltbook is humans are saying hey post this and

[00:46:35] and the agentic part of it is just the copying and the pasting not necessarily there is actually uh certainly it's possible i can't i can't vouch for what percentage of it it's a mixed it's a mixture but you could absolutely give it multiple give open claw moltbook credentials and it will go and start interacting you could tell it to do that that's it's perfectly capable of doing that i'm not sure there's any value in that whatsoever it's just a toy by by interacting it's it's copying and pasting into

[00:47:01] an uh agent into an ai chatbot and then copying and pasting from that back into moldbook it's basically not it's not this sort of like hive mind machine society it's not a it's not like a singularity it's it's more copying and pasting to and from ai chat chatbots mostly i i don't know what percentage of it is it's completely possible and maybe in the early days was that it is fully autonomous

[00:47:32] that no humans are involved and that the input that it's getting from moltbook it's responding to and posting and and it's going on like that and i think you can verify that because in many cases these threads descend into madness yeah most of the most sensational things have been faked through there's even a probably a screenshot thing that you can fake

[00:47:56] moltbook now post there is this possibility that and i think that it has happened i've seen examples that a a claw open claw instance can post something it's learned how to do on moltbook and that other open claw instances can then read it and learn how to do it as well yeah so the really interesting possibility i don't know if it's i i know these things are happening

[00:48:24] i've seen it happen but but i don't know how valuable but the real possibility is it could be a a massive step forward in terms of self-improvement that see what how did you what what was the cambrian explosion of human minds and by the way now uh anthropologists are saying there was no cambrian explosion but what what what happened it was when we started when we learned how to speak to one another and eventually write and pass information back and forth and say hey i've invented this thing

[00:48:53] called fire you should see this look you scratch these things and then and it this if if ai could start doing that am i wrong lou am i this is blue pill tell me am i claude pilled if ai could do that the potential for ai growth is exponential i think so that's a hard one talk me off the ledge

[00:49:19] i mean there's still some restrictions today so i think it's it's not going to be you know i i think there is some potential there to for you know exponential isn't self-improving ai kind of a holy grail at this point it really is it it is yeah yeah uh whether it's through a social network that ai's join or just today you know i mean i think one of the reasons claude has been making such steps forward

[00:49:43] um is that it that they are now anthropic folks are now using claude or vibe coding claude to build claude you know to build claude yeah and that's sped up sped it up it used to be you know they have a new model every year and then it's every six months now it's certainly every two months probably going to be every one month this year right who knows by the end of this year i don't know where we're going to be one more thing lou i'd like to ask you as an expert i ask everybody this it seems to be that

[00:50:12] the i prefer i would prefer to use an open weight model i want i mean that's why i bought this framework desktop with 128 gigs of ram and is i want to run this stuff locally it seems to me that local models are not i mean open weight models are not too far behind the big expensive models that's true well is true you have to have the hardware though i mean that's the thing i mean like like if you went quen on a local desktop you need like a couple gpus that are smaller but you can still run the inference but

[00:50:41] the bigger models the ones that have all of this ability to reason and and and do massive inference you need massive machines you need machines that have hundreds of gpus and so even if they were open source you still wouldn't be able to run them unless you had a server farm to do it okay yeah so the uh they call them hyperscalers are still going to be in charge right right that's why these enterprises are able to do so but you know these services are getting cheaper it's just that you still have to

[00:51:10] provide data to to a cloud service unfortunately you can't run on the edge right damn it uh all right one more uh break and then we will move on from ai there were earnings this week google phenomenal earnings um amazon phenomenal earnings and these earnings are coupled with

[00:51:32] spendings we'll talk about that in uh just a little bit lumoresca is here he uh is engineering manager at copilot for microsoft is it just excel or is it uh you have as your role expanded no it's just excel for now yeah but that's just just yeah i know it's just excel just excel just the tool number one tool used by financial analysts right by data scientists etc etc etc you you helped put python in excel which

[00:52:02] when i when that happened i thought right yeah yeah wow and we're still expanding that too so that's really cool great to have you mike elgin soon to be uh what is it attachment the attachment economy the attachment economy dot com machine society dot ai right now gastronomad.net he's in oaxaca enjoying the food and the sunshine that's right very jealous and the excellent chocolate by the way

[00:52:27] it's talking about chocolate they make it locally you took us when we went on a gastronomad adventure a few years ago you took us to a chocolate mama pacha and that place it was written up and wired for their innovative use of of uh they're basically makers and they made their own chocolate processing equipment but and the cacao beans are grown in the hills above them i mean it's in the air it's local yes and they make it and you maybe you've had mexican chocolate which i love but cinnamon and other spices

[00:52:55] in it but they make yeah the best they make chocolate that rivals any belgian chocolate you've ever had it's amazing amazing and the tasting was so much fun yeah yep love it uh so thank you mike for making making me a chocolate addict and uh larry maggot who is also a chocolate addict and ceo of connect safely notice neither one of us have run to the candy box is that your dad a picture of your dad over your

[00:53:24] left shoulder there uh yeah well let's see i can't that yeah that handsome young man or is that you that's me oh the handsome young man is me as a young man in a skinny tie skinny black tie white shirt did you work at ibm my dad is next to me right oh nice no i didn't work at ibm i was a customer of ibm's back in my late teens early 20s but uh never worked there did you have a pocket protector under that jacket

[00:53:47] no i wasn't that nerdy close but not that cool it's great to have all three of you our show today brought to you by net suite every business is asking the same question these days how do we make ai work for us of course the possibilities are endless but guessing it's too risky and sitting on the sidelines that's not an option because one thing's almost certain your competitors are already

[00:54:14] making their move no more waiting with net suite by oracle you could put ai to work today net suite is the number one ai cloud erp trusted by over 43 000 businesses it's a unified suite that brings your financials your inventory your commerce your hr your crm into a single source of truth that connected

[00:54:39] data is what makes your ai smarter so it doesn't just guess it knows intelligently automates routine tasks delivers actionable insights helps you cut costs and make fast ai powered decisions with confidence this isn't just another bolted on tool it's ai built into the system that runs your business whether your company earns millions or even hundreds of millions net suite helps you stay ahead of the pack

[00:55:05] if your revenues are at least in the seven figures get netsuite's free business guide demystifying ai at netsuite.com slash twit that guide is free to you at netsuite.com slash twit netsuite.com slash twit we thank them so much for supporting this week in tech uh microsoft had a great quarter

[00:55:29] apple had a great quarter uh alphabet had a great quarter revenue in three months of 113.8 billion dollars that's up 18 percent year over year net income almost three billion dollars a week not bad not bad uh but and this is the same story for meta meta's stop it had a great year but their

[00:55:57] stock tanked because they decided they're going to spend a lot of money and what is most of that money going to be spent on you guessed it ai to meet customer demand and capitalize this is sunar pachai talking and capitalize on the growing opportunities ahead of us our 2026 capital expenditure investments

[00:56:21] are anticipated to be in the range of 175 to 185 billion dollars a year looks like chum change when you hear microsoft has 600 billion dollars in ai commitments yeah and amazon 200 billion dollars in ai spending planned uh and so if you add them up it's alphabet microsoft meta and amazon together are looking

[00:56:49] at 700 billion which think of that number yeah is that all data centers or they would fill the stadium with 20 bills data centers it's power it's power needs it's it's all that it's data getting the data where are you going to find the data to train these things paying meta and microsoft same same basic story

[00:57:12] where the capex through the roof uh meta's capex last quarter was 22 billion dollars um and that number going to go up again they say they're going to spend about 115 135 billion dollars uh for the year microsoft in one quarter spent three billion dollars a week 37 and a half billion dollars uh capital expenditures towards cpus

[00:57:42] gpus gpus mostly again for ai demand not that microsoft's revenue was hurt it was up 81.3 billion 17 year over year growth so these companies are having huge profits you know they're spending it all it's depressing i just for some reason as you were talking about this my 1099 to connect safely from our donations from meta arrived and i'm looking at the

[00:58:12] number and it is it is nothing compared i mean i i don't even know what how many billions of fraction of zeros away from yeah the kind of money you're talking about i mean it's it's pennies but well the stock market is punishing these companies grateful for their contribution microsoft microsoft had a huge i can't remember what it was but it was a huge i mean uh they're a 12 i think

[00:58:35] their stock went down in uh in an hour uh and it's not because they're not profitable it's because they announced they're going to spend a lot of money on ai and i think the market is looking at this and saying well where's the money in ai that you're going to be spending i honestly but after what we just talked about it feels to me like there is an upside absolutely i think not only do you have to

[00:59:01] spend this money do you it is a hyperscaler uh you know because you're competing against everybody else and they're spending it but there but the but it is i don't is it a winner take all market no i think there's no there's plenty to go around i think the upsides are very strong i know the market doesn't believe that right that's the problem is i think there's people are freaking out because everyone's saying they're wasting money we haven't seen the fruits of the labor just yet and uh we're going to

[00:59:27] put our money elsewhere but i really think that this is the year of you know i coined it right now to decision making as a service it's really where these agent companies are going and that's where the money is going to make it happen so yeah and you have to spend uh at this point you have to spend to make it of course does a lot of this money go in invidia's pocket i think so

[00:59:52] well tsmc there's a lot of companies now that are doing very well tsmc which you know basically was a captive company by apple apple was using them for all of their chips has said yeah not so much anymore uh apple get in line because uh you know there's a lot of demand for our chips from nvidia and other companies has anybody tried to buy any ram lately yeah look at that it's not cheap oh yeah i had that

[01:00:17] into intuition that's why i bought the 128 gigabyte framework desktop six months ago and i and i bought a new laptop a few months ago because i i don't know what it's going to look like in this year but ram prices have more than doubled just because of this yeah companies like micron have said we're not going to sell to consumers anymore there's too much money to be made selling to enterprise um and in fact uh computers may be over it's the steam machine which uh is a pretty exciting gaming

[01:00:45] machine from valve uh is now delayed and they're saying it's going to probably cost more than we thought because we can't make them we they're too expensive so uh but you know what this is uh this is capitalism right this is this is is is it overheated is the economy overheated or is it capitalism is it a bubble or is it is it it reasonable investment to build something that's

[01:01:14] going to change everything but the problem that i'm worried about is is it possible for the startups to compete with these mega oligopical you know well that's what we're basically saying you know with lou is that billions of dollars to invest besides these companies it's the it's the hyperscalers they're going to win so they're competing against one another i don't even know if i would call that capitalism anymore i don't know what i would call it i mean the future should we should we should we

[01:01:42] be worried i think so in what way so uh i mean there's all kinds of ways is it going to crash the economy and we're all very common for industries to consolidate but usually they start out with a lot of players i mean if you go back to the car industry the beer industry any industry there'd be a ton of players then eventually it would get down to three or four big players right now there's just a handful of big players that are starting out and i don't even know how the anthropics you know how do you

[01:02:10] compete with microsoft meta google i mean i i just don't know how you compete with these with these giant and open ai at this point um it just makes it really difficult i mean maybe around the edges with niche products maybe that's the way it'll happen but i just worry a little bit about a very tiny number of companies controlled by a very small number of people having this much influence on our entire

[01:02:34] world yeah it's just a scary thought but i've had scarier thoughts before well you know what's scary for people like you and me lou is that we our retirement savings are all in the stock market right yeah me too true and um you know i'm not i just don't know what to do i just don't know you know i i have you know it's one of those i have faith in this because obviously i'm a little biased

[01:03:04] i'm working in the industry working a company that does it but that's why we should ask you because you are closest to it but i think the the thing here is that obviously there's so much money being put into it you know i talk to so many people whether it's you know people at schools or organizations and they just don't have the permission to even use ai at this point and they don't see the benefit of it and when you see corporations like gm these other companies that are actually pivoting because they're

[01:03:31] using ai to get the kind of noise out of the way and there's you know changing the way they do business like that's where the power lives and once people start to realize that you know i do there's some fear around you know agi and all that stuff but there's so much power behind this and so much freedom behind it that once it becomes accessible lives change and so i'm hoping that's what happens this year in the stock market shows well i think the other problem sorry ceo of a very small

[01:03:59] non-profit our productivity has skyrocketed in the last two years i mean i can't even begin to tell you what used to take us weeks we now do in less than a day it's just incredible how powerful this stuff can this is better than the internet better than personal computing this is a transformative technology on the order of fire steam i mean i don't know this is a new industrial era this is

[01:04:25] a new era bigger than that i mean i don't know about you but i'm electrical engineer but the other day i had a model generate a new pcb for me and send it out to get it fabricated and that would have taken me months to do and it took me hours to do so it's just it's it's transformative in a way that people don't even realize i think so and i think we're at uh we're at an intermediate point where we're using chatbots and we think that's what ai is right in fact yeah where it's going is is agentic we're going

[01:04:53] to have agentic systems that are based on personal assistants and they're going to come to us through wearables and mostly glasses and that what does that do that makes us cyborgs basically that basically typically we have a peripheral device that is prosthetic brain power and total knowledge that's the revolution as far as i'm concerned for personal use it and also business behind the scenes we have ai that's going to completely revolutionize medicine science technology space travel all the rest

[01:05:22] and so this we again i i would i would encourage everyone who pays attention to ai it's this ai chatbot thing where you go type something and type that's not it this is this is this is quaint this is nothing and i think a lot of people and i'm gonna blame microsoft a little bit lou i apologize a lot of people uh google and microsoft are the worst culprits in this uh for whom ai is pushed on them

[01:05:50] you know co-pilots pushed on you in windows uh google drive google docs constantly pushing ai on me look at it they see it as trivial not helpful annoying and decide that's ai and so there is certainly a large group of people maybe even a majority of people say ai is nothing it's terrible i hate it stop pushing it on me you know google search you know with all the ai crap they don't see what we see

[01:06:19] that where ai is really truly useful because that it's just they're not too much noise that way yeah yeah it's too much noise i agree i would love men to meta in there as well because people are seeing ai slop and that's what on facebook on social yeah the general public and and that's one of the things they say oh that's ai that's that's what ai is if you're watching this video you can see i'm wearing the meta glasses which are kind of cool you are you should have warned us that you're taking oh

[01:06:46] wait a minute we're taking actually it's cold the battery's dead and it's been dead for the bottom i can't just like them yeah i just wear them because they're glasses i mean did you get your lenses you're out of the prescription glasses yeah okay and the prescription costs a lot more than the lenses the uh what is that lens crafter has a monopoly in my area so you know you pay a lot for them that those that are glasses yep well i don't want to take each other's picture would it would there be an infinite loop

[01:07:16] yeah this is the problem with these they all look nerdy right maybe that's the goal well that's all going to change very quickly and i think that this is where we decommodify commoditize ai because people are going to use the ai that's that's suddenly be useful whatever hardware they have exactly so i think there's going to be a huge there already is a huge battle to come out with glasses that oh i just had a scary thought so i'm thinking about getting a cataract operation i don't need one yet but at some point and my doctor was saying they could put

[01:07:44] a new lens in for me could i get a smart lens and wait until those are available yeah that's a scary thought make sure it's removable the problem the problem demonic you'll need another one a year later for the upgrade exactly that's right you're going to see what that what that's like when apple comes out with neuromancer later this year it's just a thing you plug into the back of your skull

[01:08:10] right uh i call a microsoft i think one of the things that scares people also is this constant talk of an ai bubble and the stock market crashing maybe we already had that hedge funds where are we were we're february 8th this year already have made 24 billion dollars shorting software stocks right and why did software stocks tumble because the market suddenly realized oh you don't really need

[01:08:36] legal zoom you could just have your agent write the legal documents for you you don't need a lot of this software anymore now whether that's the is that the bubble bursting it's not exactly what they what they thought the bubble burst would be i think to a large extent that's that's there you know the everything behind the stock market is people right yeah and they are delusional you don't believe in the wisdom of the crowds then i don't i don't think there i don't think everybody understands

[01:09:07] where ai is going nobody understands where nobody's going but one of the one of the mistakes everybody makes is they get caught up in the hype and they go we're going to be able to lay off half our employees and replace them with chatbots well that's not how it works actually what what ai is going to do is it's going to magnify the capabilities of employees the companies that do that are going to have much greater capabilities and to compete with those companies you're also going to have lots of employees with magnified capabilities it's not about laying people off

[01:09:35] you know there's a thing called ai washing that's happening right now where because of tariffs because of economic uncertainty because downturns the market and inflation lots of companies are laying people off but to make themselves look good as ceos they're saying oh it's because we're so yeah they're blaming awesome because of ai now yeah but that's not really what's going on exactly but that's mostly bs that's right exactly in fact i've seen reports that customer service is actually improving thanks to ai certainly things like jira tickets are getting responded to faster

[01:10:05] um you know i think in many cases normal users go oh that's when i call a phone number and it's not a human and sign you're or you're are you chatting with a bot on a website and that's invariably a terrible experience but that's not just what's where ai is is changing customer service and i think in some ways it's a huge improvement i think it's very hard for us to really know what's happening and i think it's even harder

[01:10:34] for normal well it's funny because where i might have otherwise called customer service i'm sometimes just using ai to answer a question how do i get this software to work well it doesn't always get it right it wrong a lot but eventually it'll it's better than trying to call be on hold for four hours i use ai now to configure all my computers yes i could look it up i could do the web search i could ask substack

[01:10:58] whatever happened to substack but uh uh not substack uh what's the uh stack exchange i could go out yeah i could i could no i don't have to do that anymore uh my when i got that new laptop i literally configured it all with claude cloud code and you and you probably bought it with the recommendation that came through ai as well i think i think ai is very good at making recommendations for things you tell me did i asked kagi i said what's a what's the best oled laptop for running linux

[01:11:27] and it gave me some very good choices i ended up buying a thinkpad x1 carbon i was very happy i wish it had told me and there's going to be a new intel chip in two months that's going to be even better but so you have to ask the question right i remember when i bought a uh some kind of device i wanted to have auto shut off so i said i want to buy a toaster with a timer wasn't a toaster with something else and it gave me one with a timer but it was just a timer that rang it didn't wasn't a timer that

[01:11:53] turned it off so then i had to go back and say i want one with a with a timer that will automatically shut off the device and then it found some some of those for me as well but you know if you don't ask the question right you're not going to get the right answer let's take a little break i'm trying to get us out of here before uh some big game or something starts i don't know i hear there's some sports ball sport balls coming up later it's the bad bunny concert or or you have to go to the other one are you going to go to the one no the other one was canceled it was canceled are you

[01:12:21] serious the tp the kid rock canceled yeah oh my god i hadn't heard that that's amazing fox was going to show the mega super bowl concert so that you wouldn't see a puerto rican dance oh god forbid we only have to have americans not puerto ricans just americans oh wait a minute wait a minute i forgot puerto rico is a part of america part of america i think the president of the united states is not clear on that by the way they actually canceled it that's the last i saw who knows things

[01:12:51] could things it's a fast moving story uh you know what here's the good news if you don't want to see bad bunny go watch the melania movie there's choices you have choice plenty of seats it's not hard to get a ticket uh we will have more in just a bit now that we've offended half the nation no a third of the no a few people about 40 percent larry maggot it's your fault larry maggot connect safely.org

[01:13:20] um mike elgin from machine society.ai and uh by the way he does not speak for microsoft but he is engineering manager of copilot engineering leader of copilot at microsoft lou mm and i did i should have said this earlier when we talk about microsoft you're not speaking for microsoft you have no inside knowledge uh and you will recuse yourself of course if it's something of which you do have knowledge you're

[01:13:45] here as a friend of twit long time host of uh this week in enterprise tech we just love lou and uh he's one of the nicest people in the world um so thank you lou for being thank you for that appreciate it and you can't help it if he's a patriots fan it's not his fault folks our show this week brought to you by meter the company building better networks this is i i have to say i was totally stoked i got to

[01:14:12] talk to these guys a few weeks ago and i was told i had never heard of him i had to tell me about this so it was founded by a couple of network engineers years a few years ago who just knew the pain points of designing a network right and they said we need a full stack solution from soup to nuts we need to have a way to do it all because it's the only way to make sure everything works and you don't get that runaround where it's not our fault it's their fault if you're a network engineer you have been there you

[01:14:41] know the headaches legacy providers inflexible pricing it resource constraints stretching us in everybody knows that complex deployments across fragmented tools look the network's mission critical to the business your mission critical to the business but you're working with infrastructure that just wasn't built for today's demands that's why businesses are switching to meter you know who uses

[01:15:07] meter for their data centers reddit meter delivers full stack networking infrastructure and they do it everything wired wireless even cellular it's built for performance and for scalability and for reliability meter designs its own hardware that's they realized you have to do this they write their own firmware they build their own software they manage the deployments they provide after-sales support soup to nuts

[01:15:35] they offer everything from i they'll help you with isp procurement security routing switching wireless firewall cellular power dns security vpn sd win and multi-site workflows all in a single solution you know i think part of this has happened because of companies like these hyperscalers where the knowledge of how to build a data center has now migrated down to the point where meter these problems are solved

[01:16:04] and meter knows how to do it they've created a single integrated networking stack that scales i mean they're in major hospitals talk about a hostile environment a hospital is a very difficult place for wireless right because the mri machines all of the different equipment they do it for branch offices that's a big problem where you have offices in different geographic locations all in the same network meter can do it you you acquire a warehouse with their own weird wireless setup meter can transform it

[01:16:32] into something that works with your network and large campuses even data centers even as i said reddit here's a great testimonial from the assistant director of technology for the web school of knoxville he said quote we had more than 20 games athletic contests on campus going on at the same time between our two facilities 20 each game was streamed via wired and wireless connections the event went off without a

[01:17:00] hitch we could never have done this before meter redesigned our network oh it's a dream come true with meter you get a single partner for all your connectivity needs from first site survey to ongoing support without the complexity of managing multiple providers or all passing the buck right or tools meters integrated networking stack is designed to take the burden off your it team and give you deep

[01:17:26] control and visibility reimagining what it means for businesses to get and stay on line and these days that's the job right meters built for the bandwidth demands of today and tomorrow we thank meters so much for sponsoring go to meter.com twit book a demo now that's m-e-t-e-r dot com slash twit book a demo today and please use that address so they know you heard about it here i was so impressed with these guys

[01:17:52] meter.com you're going to be hearing a lot more about these guys they really they've solved a big issue uh on we go oh chief twit was wrong it has not been canceled right multiple outlets have debunked oh okay it's not canceled just a lot of the artists have dropped out but if you like kid rock you can watch him tonight no he canceled a concert that he's scheduled to do in south carolina this summer

[01:18:19] oh that's a different one uh that was when i did a google search for this i apologize okay but not apologize but if you want to watch him today he's hit a bad bunny it fox has got it you can do it fox has got it i'm recording both let's talk about privacy security here's a story that'll that'll uh from the bbc hidden cameras in chinese hotels are streaming broadcasts to thousands over telegram you can

[01:18:46] just log in uh watch real people doing intimate things because apparently this spy cam porn has existed in china for at least a decade according to bbc but in the past couple of years the issue has become a regular talking point on social media with people swapping tips on how to spot cameras as small as a pencil eraser some have even resorted this is the bbc to pitching tents inside hotel rooms to

[01:19:14] avoid being filmed is that a euphemism i pitched a tent uh what's weird is thank you thank you for bringing it to that peak uh six different and over 18 months the bbc authors discovered six different websites and apps promoted on telegram between them claiming to operate more than 180 hotel room spy cams

[01:19:41] live streaming spy cams anyway i just i guess just in china or do we have to worry about that well as well that's a good question and i guess that's why i raise it i mean we have listeners in china so but i bet you if it's happening there why wouldn't it be happening here well it's it's a it's a much bigger

[01:20:06] bigger phenomenon in china i i think i was writing about this like five or six years ago without the telegram and social media aspect but it was like at the time it was kind of an underground phenomenon right now you can find it right and you know the thing is yeah it's just it's just one of those things that's it's like smart watches on children right it's china leads the world by orders of magnitude ahead of everyone else this is just another thing that's just happening there that shouldn't be happening

[01:20:34] anywhere obviously um but um but yeah it's it's still around it's still a big deal and the the key element of it and the reason that that chinese operators aren't going global is that you have to have access to the hotel right to plant the camera right right and uh and so it's it's really so far thank goodness more of a chinese phenomenon but it's something you have to keep in mind if you travel to

[01:21:00] china because i'm sure that you know um i'm sure that the audience would love love to see some uh some some uh foreign victims uh you will be seeing a few ads on the super bowl for ai we certainly saw that last year and i mentioned that open ai in anthropic will have dueling ads but also you'll see a lot of

[01:21:24] ads generated by ai uh this year uh and i think it's another reason people hate hate a ai is because of the the coca-cola ad which was played incessantly over the holidays was i think intentionally done badly they wanted mcdonald's horrible too yeah they pulled that one that wasn't in the u.s but they had to pull that one um so one of the first ads you'll see is for a vodka svedka in which uh a voluptuous

[01:21:54] humanoid woman and her muscular male companion are dancing in a club with bottles in hand they're robots so it's kind of it's ai about ai drinking vodka why would you want to drink a vodka that robots drink uh why would you want to feed vodka to your robot don't right scary enough with this video yeah i think this might be to get around the rules that you can't be drinking a human can't be drinking alcohol on screen drinking an ad but a robot can

[01:22:25] um the the problem is that culturally we're in we're entering into an era where ai equals cheap and so this is one of the big thing problems with the coca-cola ads coca-cola has some legendary ads uh so does mcdonald's you know if you like advertising they've had some very masterful beautiful brilliant well-engineered ads well written great jingles all the rest and then to do an ai slop

[01:22:53] you know for example uh the coca-cola commercial there were there were nerds on reddit who were counting the number of axles so within one within one um commercial uh the the the axle configurations on the trucks that were depicted there was like 18 of them or something like that different configurations of axle the ai is just making up axle configurations on trucks things like that but so that's the thing that they probably did i'm thinking could have fixed but decided not to for

[01:23:20] some reason they wanted people to know this was ai generated but they had to go running with their tail between their legs and retreat and oh did they take them down and apologize and all that stuff they keep doing it like these big companies keep coming out with you're spending eight million dollars for a 30 second ad hire an actor one thing here we are talking about it right well that's true my son will be in the hellman's mayonnaise ad look for him he's on for less than a second so you're gonna have

[01:23:49] to look very very closely it's an ad yeah you'll see the mustache that's why you know immediately it's i'll hang it's a hellman's ad uh featuring uh andy samberg as neil diamond singing sweet sandwich time and when he gets to the bop bop bop henry's one of the bop bop bop so just look for the when it gets to bop bop bop um gemini becomes an ai interior decorator in google's super bowl ad you'll see

[01:24:19] it's the new home commercial featuring nostalgic piano music and the heartfelt voiceover of a mother and son envisioning their new home with the help of gemini um so sweet sweet sweet i think that's maybe they're trying to humanize it right at this point instead of uh vodka drinking robots crypto.com is going to launch it spent by the way hundreds of millions of dollars on ai.com somebody was

[01:24:48] somebody was sitting on that domain i can't remember what the final amount was i had thought of that it it was several hundred million dollars for that um they're going to promote it uh it says as a way for users to quote generate a private personal ai agent that doesn't just answer questions but actually operates on the user's behalf you'd trust crypto.com to do that wouldn't you ai.com

[01:25:18] uh you're gonna see a word plus i do now i i didn't at first but at the last line of this it's for the good of humanity oh well that's different the world oh i wish no problem yeah okay i'd known yeah it scared me for a minute leo but but they let's confirm that this is going to be the year of agentic ai for sure i mean this year you you nailed it mike uh amazon uh is going to have an a word plus uh it's going to try to kill chris hemsworth

[01:25:49] a standoff with amazon's ai assistant which he fears is planning elaborate ways to kill him i do see that seems like a mistake seems like a mistake uh on amazon's part um we mentioned anthropic super bowl ad uh there will not be any ads for uh the prediction markets calci or poly market it's a prohibited category according to the nfl you know why i suspect it's prohibited

[01:26:17] because they love draft kings so so leo interestingly there was just a big earthquake here in oaxaca no i hear that i hear the horn and it's still going so i'm having an earthquake right now oh yeah you're you're shaking or you want to go you want to dive under your desk

[01:26:41] if the power goes out i think his internet is going out i'm going to usgs.gov right now to figure this out yeah wow not the first earthquake we've had during a live show by the way real term data might be the the strongest though it still looks like it's still shaking uh yeah you can go you can put usgs on the screen here it is cruise bay that oaxaca no there's earthquakes

[01:27:10] everywhere there are earthquakes everywhere yeah i know i used to follow there's a twitter used to be the twitter account where you could get tweets when there was an earthquake and it was just like constant so i stopped yeah i don't see the one in oaxaca yet on the screen it's happening 5.7 it says oh that's strong oh that's really strong okay okay mike are you still there yeah

[01:27:34] yes i'm here i i just got my audio back yeah there's a big earthquake my phone lit up the sirens went off in town and uh but yeah it's an it's another earthquake in oaxaca dude is it a common thing still kind of shaking but um are you you're actually not on a big fault actually not i don't think it's that coming i know and no i we just got back from el salvador which is constantly having

[01:28:00] earthquakes but yeah this was i guess it's a little bit more rare here in oaxaca okay well 5.7 the dogs are barking pretty serious yeah all right well stay safe if you need to dive off that's okay no i'm sure it's fine i'm i'm good you're a bay area guy earthquakes do not phase you although 5.7 yeah 5.7 is pretty big yeah what was it one of the most alone for you yeah you remember five nine

[01:28:29] i think yeah yeah i was at uh the world series game at the candlestick park yeah during that that was uh that was exciting yeah wow we had to i was in santa barbara watching it on tv and i was just like oh my god i'm sorry 6.9 i got that wrong it was six points so that was quite a bit bigger yeah that's that's uh more than 10 times bigger yeah like 5.7 doesn't just laugh at it's funny because i'm looking at the usgs and i don't see it on there yet which is a surprise yeah i i looked too i

[01:28:59] didn't see it either i got a notification on my phone instantly that was really interesting that's something that i mean that's lately the same time i felt i i've seen that lately uh both apple and android do that yeah uh and and you will get a second or two before the earthquake just maybe just enough time to find safety a notification that there's one coming depends i guess how close you are to the

[01:29:24] epicenter yeah yeah uh well let's take a break and then that way uh mike can uh adjust and if you need to change your pants you can go ahead and do that too just a little bit helpful hey i'm nothing if not considerate mike elgin visiting us from uh shaky oaxaca machin society.ai gastronomad.net uh also from uh new england at lou mareska who is a

[01:29:53] patriots and a seahawks fan i don't know what he's going to do this afternoon engineering leader for co-pilot of microsoft you know you usually have a green screen behind you i didn't know you have beautiful windows in your office you have a beautiful thank you is that snow out the window it is snow yeah the snow never melted this year did it no in fact we just got another eight inches yesterday so oh mg that is not typical no this is no we usually don't get this much yeah but uh it's been a lot

[01:30:21] yeah i remember my youth in providence we'd get snow but there has but they stopped after a while and uh yeah yeah that's pretty snowy in new england right now well stay stay stay safe too stay warm more important yes i think i bet the boys are loving it though they're running out oh gosh they love it yeah they adore it yeah uh and of course larry maggot who is uh ceo of connect safely don't forget

[01:30:46] tuesday safer internet i just checked i went to chat gpt i said is there an earthquake in oaxaca mexico and it said it's a 4.1 it led me to allquakes.com huh but it said it said 4.1 so i'm not sure how it and mike's information are different but interesting but it beat out usgs and reporting that news which i found very which is wild amazing yeah yeah our show today brought to you by a brand

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[01:34:15] slash twit css and submit a form to get in contact with trusted tech's microsoft support engineers great information from great people trustedtech.team slash twit css we thank them so much uh for their support for this week in tech trustedtech.team slash twit css one of the we we didn't talk about finance but we

[01:34:43] didn't mention one of the biggest stories of the week which is that spacex has acquired xai now remember it's all in the family eon elon owns them all spacex is expected to have a big ipo later this year xai is expected to spend lots of money over the next 12 months and during the announcement elon said something

[01:35:09] that a number of people have thought maybe a little odd that spacex and they did apply to the fcc for this wants to launch a million a million data centers in space elon says it's a step to becoming a kardashev 2 civilization uh a number of people said you know data centers in space don't make a lot of

[01:35:35] sense elon says there's you know if if you're running on solar power space is five times more efficient than land-based solar power uh they've really brought the cost of launches down that's one of the things spacex did do with their reusable rockets um well if you want to make a lot of money on on uh elon musk's um predictions just go to the prediction market and bet against him

[01:36:02] he has yet to it's a sure thing so many exactly they want to launch a million tons per year of satellites each generating 100 kilowatts of compute power i'm sorry 100 kilowatts of power per ton so that would be 100 gigawatts of ai compute annually elon says with no ongoing operational or maintenance needs well you can't it's in space so you can't set a tech up you know if you

[01:36:32] if it doesn't work you just de-orbit it and launch another one you know what's really bad for computers is radiation and there's a lot of that in space there is sometimes people think well it's very cool up there but no it's actually harder to cool a data center in space because there's no medium around it there's no air around it to for which the heat can go off you have to condition you can't have air conditioners if there's no air the the you know this is basically it's it being uh pitched as a way for

[01:37:02] for elon musk's ai to have the future of data centers but what it actually is is spacex is a winner of a company and x.com is a loser of a company which is part of this deal and so basically they're just kind of folding in the loser into the winner then they have an ipo and it's all just just just part of this thing where you know all the companies do this to a certain extent they sort of obfuscate uh

[01:37:27] the sort of the the the parts of their business that are losing money that aren't doing well and couch it under a umbrella where it all seems to be doing pretty well that seems to be above all what's happening reed albergatti writing at semaphore has coined a new term for these um he says the natural evolution of big tech from primarily software-based companies to extraterrestrial industrial giants

[01:37:54] e-i-g's give me a break it's very sci-fi yeah i got another sci-fi thing for you it's called the kessler effect oh yeah that's not sci-fi yeah china wants to be in satellites in space sector put a million days it's all fun and games until they until the dominoes start falling and then you could actually cut off all the light from the sun and you wouldn't have to worry about global warming anymore

[01:38:23] nope or or or or getting a sunburn so with the space shuttle it cost fifty four thousand dollars per kilogram to put something in orbit thanks to spacex and the falcon heavy it's one thousand four hundred dollars per kilogram uh while the cost of traveling by car has gone up 150 over the same period

[01:38:47] at some point elon says the it'll be 200 a kilogram and at that point launching data centers into space makes economic sense unlimited solar energy there are challenges for cooling but there are ways to radiate that heat off uh i mean to be fair reed also says a good rule of thumb when it comes to musk is

[01:39:13] right call wrong clock yeah yeah i mean i'm driving an electric vehicle and i probably wouldn't be if it weren't for elon and tesla i'm still driving a tesla or actually it's it's driving me i hardly ever touched the steering you have a model s as a model three three and uh it's i've got the the new you know the hardware for fsd they don't call it autopilot anymore i've got fsd and uh i as much as i hate to

[01:39:39] admit it because i'm not an elon musk fan it is very close to flawless now it really has gotten very good since the days you sold your model x where it was crap when you had it yeah i was at least i always thought it was trying to drive her into the median strip no it's it's quite good now i have i have a model x and this weekend it drove into a pothole and i got a plat tire not good that is by the way an underappreciated downside to electric vehicles they're so heavy that

[01:40:07] they run through tires at a rapid absolutely 450 later yeah your model x is going to become a collector's item i know i should keep it i know i love it i do truly love it it's just but you know it does have its nuances unfortunately i loved it too but lisa called it christine well you know it's funny we're talking about ai so grok is built into into teslas now so all i have to do is push a button on my steering wheel and i can talk to grok and i do i normally wouldn't use grok but it's right

[01:40:33] there and it's not nearly as bad as its reputation and its reputation is horrible yeah because of this is what i was saying earlier they come there these ai chat bots for most uses and most people are somewhat commodified commoditized and it's the hardware that will determine which one you use in this case but you know if i'm driving down the road and i say i'm looking for a restaurant it'll recommend

[01:40:59] one and it'll actually drive me there it'll reprogram my my gps and do you have it uh do you have a cute voice it's a very cute voice and uh do you get your choice of voice she loves me she she's very close yeah that's the problem yeah i don't know yeah so um so so just just a quick you know we we talked briefly on on elon musk's uh claims about data centers in space um i don't think we should move off the

[01:41:26] topic until we really understand what a terrible idea this is in the time frame again that he's talking about so the so the problems are or the costs are vastly higher than the cost of a data center on earth there's space debris which is a problem nobody has an answer for right it's getting worse and worse with all these satellites going up oh you did talk about the thermodynamics and the heat and the radiation and all those problems another one that people aren't really talking about is the maintenance

[01:41:52] of repair you got a million data centers in space and data centers on earth which are far less complex and subject to gravity and things like that uh need lots of maintenance and they need people working on them and chipping away so that's another issue getting people there and back uh and then you have the the basic uh fundamentals of the of the market like you right now we have this big boom in data center development there'll be there'll come a time where that it's going to back off and those

[01:42:20] things are going to be very cheap because you know the boom will go too far and so doing something in space takes like 10 times longer right and so how do you right size the quantity of these things it's just a big problem there's another there's another one to add to that too is a security like how are you gonna like it's like open season for governments to shoot them down right like if you have secure data up there like how are you going to secure it if they can just pluck them out of the sky

[01:42:48] you're going to be able to get to that point that's probably where i should bring up the story about russia intercepting eu satellites this is from also from a sem se a semaphore russian space vehicles have approached physically approach european satellites and intercept their communications according to officials two objects have passed dangerously close to some of europe's most important

[01:43:13] geostationary satellites is from the financial times uh the satellites lack advanced onboard computers that could encrypt their transmissions so the data is is coming off the in plain text which also leaves a vulnerable to interference i read that they actually hacked them uh is that not the case yeah um well it's certainly theoretically possible this uh the par the

[01:43:38] parliament wrote it could provide a blueprint for sabotaging european space systems um moscow stepped up i guess space warfare fortunately we've got space force to protect us and so you know that is that is the one thing i do not want to see is a space war all right so yeah you

[01:44:07] know i think my theory is that elon uh i i used to think elon just smoked too much weed and used too much ketamine and so as a result was kind of uh you know kind of had some outlandish ideas now i'm thinking maybe it's stock manipulation maybe he's just because he's got an ipo coming up maybe he just is hoping the stock market will buy it and then buy his stock he wants to raise a lot of money for space

[01:44:34] certainly doing well with tesla stock yeah and yeah he's done very well hasn't he and he there's he's been accused of pump and dump schemes using uh x uh no i've been enjoying the revenue from turning my model three into a robo taxi for years now oh yeah right 2018 is when the right writing it out right i mean i i don't know but you can't you can never read somebody's mind what their

[01:44:59] intentions are but uh it's it certainly benefits him financially if people buy this notion well this is the old silicon valley thing right and and he's like the poster child for this kind of thinking you all always you always go after the maximum most incredible outlandish version of that you don't if you're if you're google like you know 15 years ago you don't say you know yeah we're gonna we're gonna

[01:45:24] grow email to to capture a two digit part of the market you say no we're gonna expand until there are there are six billion people using gmail a ridiculous number right and and you just go for it right you just like go for the maximum thing you can possibly attempt and you fall way way short in the case of

[01:45:46] elon musk you fall way way yeah there's also there's one other thing that comes to my mind um now by the way i use starlink that's my i have comcast internet but because comcast is not 100 reliable i have a fail over to starlink got a little dish up on the roof and those are the only two high speed choices available to me so i don't i would prefer not to use either but that's the only if i'm going

[01:46:12] to do shows for my attic it's the only way i could do that um but there's also this issue of well if elon's got a million satellites in space and starlink is the dominant choice elon has huge geopolitical power uh he's already remember he you know he used a cut off the ukraine uh uh and now ukraine said moscow's terminals have been cut off russia is supposedly not supposed to

[01:46:39] use starlink but has been uh illegally mounting starlink systems on its attack drones um activists in iran use starlink after tehran imposed internet blackouts but elon holds the master switch to this right uh from semaphore relying solely on starlink given musk's strong political views quote can be really dangerous from a country's sovereignty perspective

[01:47:07] this is nbr global south starlink you know we saw that some time ago when when uh brazil ordered a brazilian judge ordered uh musk to or ordered x.com to remove a post he refused so they basically went through the carriers within brazil to to block x but then uh starlink was blasting uh internet and and x into

[01:47:34] brazil uh and then they started going after those and and so it was basically this war between a sovereign nation and a single oligarch basically who was using multiple companies to override the legal authority and the sovereignty of the brazilian government and so and at some point uh musk backed off but he didn't have to back off he could have not backed off and so but that was just a glimpse into the future of

[01:48:02] individual people who have the power of nation states or exceed the power of nation states and here's it this elon musk represents an individual person richest man in the world worth 800 billion dollars powerful space program the nation of brazil yep uh and you know having 800 billion dollars doesn't mean you can have a bigger hat what does mean you could have a bigger

[01:48:26] house and a nice yacht but really what it means to elon is a lot of power and i think at this point it's not about accumulating power uh dollars it's about accumulating power and do we want to allow him that power wants to have more robots more more tesla robots than there are people on earth imagine that what's interesting i just i just asked millions of robots for what countries have a lower gdp than

[01:48:51] elon musk's net worth and there are several oh yeah he is wealthier than many higher countries he's going to be our first trillion dollar man yeah pretty scary all right uh one more break and then uh what i call the back of the book the uh the other news we are having fun getting ready for the big game which is about an hour off we're going to get you off

[01:49:18] uh the show in time lou to root for both teams you hope that can there be a tie in the super bowl i don't think so i think i don't think all my kids are rooting for patriots so i might have to go the other way just to be the odd man out do you have an appropriate jersey to wear you know i have i should wear both i have both so my my nephew's also it's funny because my nephew is also a seattle's fan and my other nephew is a new england's fan so it's it's like it's a battle for this to today it's

[01:49:48] gonna be great just wear the one who's winning at the time just keep the one that on there you go whoever's leaving yeah put on both and then strip one off if the other one starts winning i don't have a horse in this race but one of my employees works in um lives in boston and i'm going to be meeting she's coming out for safer internet today and i wanted to be in a good mood for that reason alone i'm backing the patriots well i'm gonna i i can't root for the seahawks because there are

[01:50:14] mortal enemies which is why i'm wearing my 49ers shirt uh today but uh there's a good reason to root for the patriots i hope the the coach is you know wins this wins and he's also uh you know does this uh was the most winning coach and also the person who's never won the super bowl but also won as a coach so that's that's awesome too yeah and it's kind of an interesting uh story unfortunately will mean the patriots have how many super bowl victories seven it's not i mean that

[01:50:44] makes me mad but okay you know hey at least we beat the eagles we got the eagles out of it for you so there uh i don't know we don't i don't understand sport ball so i just i'm pretending i fake it i fake it well larry maggot is also here for internet safer internet day celebrating this week and uh from earthquake prone oaxaca she's not exactly earthquake prone but earthquake

[01:51:10] not really but we but today it is and we're going to be going we're going to be meeting up with some friends and watching the super bowl in a pub here in oaxaca it's actually surprisingly popular yeah american football any excuse to drink more pulque or or that's really that's really the thing that i like about the super bowl best of all i love drinking beer and eating greasy food yeah i've got queso cooking in my slow cooker downstairs sweet sweet it's martha stewart's queso recipe i don't know

[01:51:40] how authentic it is but i'll find out i put extra jalapenos in just to make it uh good tasty our show today brought to you by zscaler you need to know about zscaler the world's largest cloud security platform we've been talking about the potential rewards of ai for any business you know too significant to ignore but there are also risks uh and and all kinds of risks the loss of sensitive data

[01:52:09] attacks against enterprise managed ai and of course generative ai really increases the opportunities for threat actors helping them to rapidly create phishing lures to write malicious code to automate data extraction as we just were talking about earlier to find zero days and code you're running there in fact if you think about it it's like what why am i using ai but you have to right you just have

[01:52:32] to use it intelligently carefully you need zscaler to protect you there were 1.3 million instances of social security numbers leaked through sas ai applications chat gpt and microsoft copilot saw nearly 3.2 million data violations it's time to rethink your organization's safe use of public and private ai chad pallet is

[01:52:57] the acting cso at bio ivt he says zscaler helped them reduce their cyber premiums reduce their cyber premiums by 50 percent and double their coverage plus improving their controls take a look at this from chad with zscaler as long as you've got internet you're good to go a big part of the reason that we moved to a consolidated solution away from sdwan and vpn is to eliminate that lateral opportunity that people

[01:53:24] had and that opportunity for misdirection or open access to the network it also was an opportunity for us to maintain and provide our remote users with a cafe style environment thanks chad with zscaler zero trust plus ai you can safely adopt generative ai and private ai to boost productivity across the business their zero trust architecture plus ai helps you reduce the risks of ai related data loss

[01:53:51] to greater guarantee the productivity and compliance of your company learn more at zscaler.com security that's zscaler.com security we thank them so much for their support of this week in the video uh a lot of the uh a lot of people use windows uh and use a program called notepad plus plus

[01:54:15] it's a really nice uh third party kind of improvement on notepad uh well it was kind of a problem uh this week uh it turns out the chinese it looks like chinese state-sponsored hackers uh did a supply chain attack on notepad plus plus dot org and that people were downloading notepad plus plus

[01:54:39] from that site certain not everybody this was a very clever hack certain targeted users were selectively redirected to attacker control malicious updates uh so they got a version of notepad plus plus that had um malware in it

[01:55:03] uh according to the former now former hosting provider the shared hosting was compromised through september of 2025 even after losing server access attackers maintained credentials to internal services until december 2025 which allowed them to so so between september and december september october november for three months they were able to redirect notepad plus plus update traffic to malicious servers

[01:55:32] but they weren't trying to attack everybody who uses notepad plus plus they were looking it it looks like specifically for overseas chinese chinese dissidents uh it was all fixed after december 2nd but this should scare people um the author of notepad plus plus says i deeply apologize to all users

[01:55:55] affected by this hijacking i recommend downloading version 8.9.1 which fixes you know has the relevant security enhancement and running the installer to update notepad plus plus manually make sure you were not infected it's too bad i loved i loved no possible plus plus but there's been a bunch of exploits in the last couple years and i just kind of stepped away from it and uh you know went to vs code so it's one

[01:56:20] of those well vs code is so great it's one of those programs though that he was updating a lot which on the one hand is good on the other hand not necessarily so good uh and in this case for three months people potentially were a bit just a word it's part of a larger story of the chinese government basically uh

[01:56:41] considers it's a global um suppression global um sort of uh censorship global control of the chinese diaspora around the world exactly they're not in meddling meddling in everything but they're all over the people who have left china and now live in other countries there's a recent uh article somewhat typical for the last few years of somebody who was going to go to a film a screening of films that were

[01:57:08] chinese films in new york city and he's an american of chinese descent and there was some criticism of the chinese communist party and so on and he got a call from his father who said who was in a panic saying don't do anything stupid don't do this or that because the chinese is uh oh use the family within china to control the the actions and the free speech of of chinese americans and others around the world so this is a very very a much bigger story and cyber attacks is

[01:57:37] a big part of it actually and um a lot of people don't care much about it because it doesn't supply chain cyber attacks diaspora yeah the supply chain attacks are very scary very sophisticated i mean obviously yeah yes new york's according to adafruit new york wants to control alt delete your 3d printer uh this is a bill that is not yet uh passed but it's in the budget bill language that should alarm

[01:58:03] every maker educator and small manufacturer in new york state buried in part c says adafruit a provision requiring all 3d printers sold or delivered in new york should include blocking technology software or firmware that scans every print file through a firearms blueprint detection algorithm they don't want people to 3d print guns which i guess i understand but it refuses to print anything it flags as potential firearm or firearm component if you have ever used an ai and been told i can't do

[01:58:32] that that that that's going to violate my uh my principles you realize that this kind of software can be wrong in a lot of a lot of ways uh but i see this is akin to software within drone uh applications drone apps that control dgi drones that prevent you from flying over sensitive military bases and and other things like that i mean

[01:58:58] if something can be dangerous and if if that danger can be mitigated through software i understand the the reasoning for it um i'm not super adafruit says free speech issuer adafruit says one of the problems is you cannot reliably detect firearms from geometry alone which is how this would have to work so if cell shaped if it has a pipe a tube a block a bracket a gear is it a gun is it a part of a gun um it would affect all open source

[01:59:26] firmware marlin clipper rep wrap it would affect offline machines printers that never touch the internet uh it will affect file formats the algorithm can't parse raw g code custom slicers parametric designs it would affect cnc mail mills so it would really be a problem for 3d printers just bring it to your attention is not yet a law it is in the budget bill which means you know unless it's stripped out it's likely to pass

[01:59:57] western digital is planning 140 terabyte hard drives what could possibly go wrong that's the wrong that's the wrong story i got the wrong story on there um are you ready for 140 terabyte hard drive how you'll definitely need a spin right hey

[02:00:21] those raw blu-ray files are 80 gigs so you know it's a 14 platter three and a half inch they call it the hammer hdd design you know it blows me away how long lived this spinning drive technology is i thought by i thought by 2000 we would have solid state memory there there's no way

[02:00:47] spinning drives would survive past 2000 not only have they survived we're going we're going beyond 140 terabytes in the in the near future also ai is making ssds more expensive so we're going to stay here for a while yeah well i mean and and really yeah well how do what do you back well you don't back up you back up to it right it's that's what goes in your nas i guess although i have a 30 terabyte nas i don't

[02:01:12] even need 140 terabyte it's all media it's all media it's media hoarders you know yeah get ready for the wordle crisis the new york times has announced that uh that started february 2nd so they started this week they're going to start reusing words there's no reason they need to the patrick wortle who designed

[02:01:34] wortle uh came up with four nearly half a million five letter words that could be used in wordle uh he narrowed it down to 22 949 by things like excluding proper nouns and plurals and anything

[02:01:55] without a case level uh he got the word list down to 5 437 words so that's sounds like it's short well a word a day from that list would give you 15 years of wordle wordle started october 2021 so there are enough words in there good words to go through 2036 patrick says why are you repeating

[02:02:21] new york times why no one knows but i just thought i'd warn you if you see a word and you say i wasn't this a wordle word before you gotta wonder how long they're gonna milk that after they spent 10 million dollars on it it has saved the new york times look what happened to the washington post this week i mean

[02:02:45] it's been decimated uh the new york times is the last national newspaper standing and well wall street journal oh i guess you had the wall street journal too yeah but general but it's a little bit of a niche market yeah because you pay money for the wall street journal to make money right you're going to get financial information that helps you make money the new york times you pay for it for the crossword puzzle and wordle yeah the new york times the new york times the recipes and the recipes and some good

[02:03:15] reporters no the new york yeah i agree yeah and there will be more good reporters because i imagine a number of people from the washington post 300 people fired including by the way their excellent tech reporter jeffrey fowler and j and joseph mann as well and joseph mann yeah former la times colleague of mine they're not going to do any more tech they're not going to do any more sports they're not going to do any more international coverage so there was a great piece was at the atlantic and

[02:03:42] said you could buy a yacht or you could buy a newspaper actually the newspaper was half the price of the yacht it was half the price of the yacht two newspapers for the cost of one yacht the newspaper cost us apparently he could run it for years so why i mean bezos has more money than he could run this thing in a complete deficit forever right what's going on is it well we know what's going on

[02:04:10] some men just like to watch the world burn i guess democracy dies in the darkness of bezos's pockets it's gotten dark um here's a picture of jeff did he ever buy a yacht or he just bought a newspaper doesn't he have a half a billion dollar yacht yeah i think he has a yacht yeah no so his the the support yacht for his yacht costs more than the washington than this

[02:04:36] yeah in the wall street journal his yacht is so big it has its own yacht that's how big this yacht is it has to because you know i mean he could afford all the yachts and all the newspapers i mean it's not he doesn't have to really make a choice do you what i mean i cheered when he bought i mean i was happy that we thought it would be a good thing didn't right for a while yeah yeah um incidentally the ceo

[02:05:01] that came in i think probably there's good reason to believe to dismantle the washington post uh is gone he left and now the former ceo of tumblr is in charge okay okay uh tumblr which is owned by automatic actually automatic's done something pretty good they have a new plugin that they've designed in conjunction with the wayback machine the internet archive

[02:05:31] to fix the internet's broken links problem uh the two organizations automatic and the internet archive have launched a new wordpress plugin called the link fixer that is designed to combat the scourge of link rot uh automatic says the new plugin works by scanning your wordpress posts for outbound links cross-referencing the wayback machine for archived versions of those links

[02:06:01] if there are none it will automatically take new snapshots of the articles in question put them on the archive so your blog will always link to either the original live site or if that site has disappeared the internet archive don't you think that's a great idea although you the problem the problem is you're going to get old information if the site literally disappeared but at least i guess that's hey at least you get something right you get the washington post

[02:06:33] and i wonder if there'll be a paywall on the on the archiver god bless the internet archive i you know there isn't a paywall in an archive but i donate every month because that is the most one of the that and wikipedia which i also donate every month to are really the things that makes the internet a great thing what about craigslist is that still a great thing yeah but they're making money so it's okay they don't need my money yeah craigslist is a great do

[02:06:59] you think craigslist made the internet great though it didn't do very it didn't help newspapers but it certainly uh changed the classified advertising business somebody is now stealing my car i see on our cameras i'm hoping it's my wife i remember when i used to be a landlord i used to have a rental house and craigslist with a godfist for yeah well craig newmark we love craig newmark he's he's appeared on our shows many times he's a fan of uh intelligent machines and he's taken the money

[02:07:27] he made from craigslist and donated it to many many good causes he has including saving the pigeons but that's not the the best of his causes but it's a good one and craigslist is amazing and it's probably helped out more like non-tech people than you think like it's helped out so many people craigslist is amazing what is your number one use for craigslist benito that's finding an apartment

[02:07:50] in san francisco yeah yeah have you ever used it for dates no but i also use it for buying and selling musical gear that's like the best place in times it depends where you live also in san francisco it's the best benito do you have at hand the craig newmark jingle by i don't i tried but i don't yeah we have a we have a jingle whenever we mention his name on intelligent machines uh the singers come

[02:08:17] on and sing his name uh project hail mary is getting its own lego set just in time for the movie this is a great book by andy we're so good love the book love andy we're love the martian uh if you haven't read project hail mary read it now before the movie comes out the movie will not only spoil it it won't be as good i guarantee you and it might be a great movie i'm not saying that the martian was a great movie but it's always better in my opinion at least with andy weir to read the book first

[02:08:47] project hail mary comes out march 20th uh the new lego set is an 830 piece set that is a replica of the hail mary spaceship oh it's got a spoiler don't look oh this is why you got to read the book now because it'll be spoiled for you by it don't even look at the hail mary trailer which spoils it well the movie the movie trailer yeah the trailer spoils it i mean

[02:09:12] they literally show they show the thing that's a surprise we don't want to show the thing and apparently i just showed it i hope you didn't see it i took it down right away so does the lego set so read do if you haven't read a project hail mary do yourself a favor read it it's only a spoiler if you read the book though like if you didn't read the book you kind of need that information right well read the book get the spoiler now you can see all the other stuff

[02:09:38] we don't let them yeah so don't let a movie trailer spoil a great book yeah or a lego set read the book watch the movie and get the lego set in that order um didn't i have this mcdonald's story in here mcdonald's is pissed off

[02:09:59] because people are using mcdonald's uh stuff as their passwords and mcdonald's says you should never use any of our stuff as a password i guess i took it out what do you mean by stuff what do you mean like uh hamburglar a lot of people use hamburger hamburger that's a great password

[02:10:20] they say stop it knock it off no i can't i can't find it oh shoot i took it out i thought that was one of the best stories of the week yeah mayor mccheese that's a great password yeah mayor mccheese don't don't use mcdonald's mcdonald's tells customers here's the story

[02:10:47] mcdonald's is not loving your big mac happy meal and mcnuggets mcnuggets passwords uh i guess uh last weekend was change your password date didn't know that little uh public service announcement you do not need to change your password unless it's been compromised compromised and any good password manager including our sponsor bitwarden will tell you if it's been compromised mcdonald's netherlands took the opportunity last week to tell customers

[02:11:14] when it comes to choosing a password that's easy to remember do not pick the names of our products according to have i been pwned mcdonald's says big mac and its leet speak variants were found more than 110 000 times in the compromised password corpus also happy meal mcnuggets and french fries also common

[02:11:37] and it doesn't make it any safer to use the leet speak you know one for l that doesn't that doesn't help you don't get to claim french fries mcdonald's they actually mcdonald's made an ad this is from mcdonald's netherlands i don't think we'll get taken down why is it in dutch though i don't know this was uh the ads placed in dutch subway stations and other spaces saying

[02:12:05] do not use chicken mcnuggets as a great password you know what i don't i don't i just obviously it's an ad for mcdonald's right but uh it gets you thinking about chicken mcnuggets it got you yeah it's got you thinking about it i think that's pretty pretty funny february 1st was change your password day update your password don't use chicken mcnuggets with leet with leet speak as your past

[02:12:32] it's like a bad idea to have a like a password day change your password day like that means that yeah a great day for people to watch your your traffic right yeah do not change your password unless you think it's been breached if you have a really good long password keep it the problem is when people change their passwords they tend to change them for something they can remember right and that's not an improvement i have ones that i can remember but they're they're

[02:12:56] very it's an algorithm in my head which helps me remember i i do song lyrics things like that know your favorite songs and break into your account i'm more clever than that okay poems i like poems anything that i could say in my mind uh you know uh another one that i i don't use but people recommend

[02:13:22] is if you do the first letter the last name of every president united states capitalizing the republicans uh you know you you want what you want is a long password that you can create with an algorithm right right but you wouldn't do all the presidents as many as you remember how about just your favorite presidents your favorites it would be best if it was something that you could actually that's why i use

[02:13:44] song lyrics or poems because i can say them in my head and go half your passwords begin with roses are red that's not a good one yeah unfortunately the password i used for my bitcoin wallet was not well it's interesting you know i get notifications from google about all these of all these you know my your information appears on the dark web yeah and it's always the same password that i retired maybe 20 years ago yeah right but i'm still getting notifications on that password and it was

[02:14:13] a horrible password by the way yeah monkey one two three i keep something it was mine was i could do that yeah uh and then finally and somebody already said this they said oh they literally always ends with somebody dying the only i'll tell you the only reason i do this is because a i'm i'm old and i pay attention to obituaries kids this is going to happen to you when you get to a certain age you start reading the obituaries first yeah just to see and you do the math you're

[02:14:41] like okay do that my age minus you know yeah whatever you know it's sort of like when you're a certain age you go to birthday parties and then bar mitzvahs or christening and then weddings and yeah you know what's next i'm going to a funeral on friday so uh and when katherine o'hera passed i immediately did the math and she's two years older than me that's younger than oh and younger than you yeah uh sad to say that one of the they could sometimes call him the grandfather of the internet

[02:15:08] david farber has passed he died yesterday professor of computer science uh known for his contributions to computer languages and networking um he was at the rand corporation scientific data systems at uc irvine uc delaware carnegie mellon of course won all of the uh computer awards founding editor of i can watch board of advisors of context relevant the liquid information company one of the founding

[02:15:38] board members of the internet systems consortium served on the board since 1994 and he was 91 so but he lived a good long life and made major contributions boy what he would he yeah what he saw and accomplished yeah inducted into the internet hall of fame in 2013. so uh dave farber uh i i only found out about this because i saw it on hacker news people go oh he dave farber passed but yet 91 is it's okay

[02:16:06] it's okay uh ladies and gentlemen you still have half an hour before the super bowl good news time to get your seahawks jersey on and then put your patriots jersey on top of that top of that and when the seahawks go ahead you rip it off say see i was a seahawks fan all along lou mareska so nice to see you thank you so much for being here engineering leader at copilot microsoft uh one of my favorite

[02:16:31] people in the world actually all three of you i just always love having people on that i admire and respect and love learning from thank you so much for being here lou really appreciate it appreciate it same to you mike elgin suffering through an earthquake it's taco time i'm not shook up yeah no it's going to be an english pub so i think we're going to have fish and chips and oh how fun to beer that's one of the

[02:16:55] things people think mexicans eat mexican food no they just call it food and uh second of all uh actually there's all kinds of all kinds of food yeah they are most of the street food here is hot dogs and hamburgers isn't that fun which is yeah usual that's right uh it's great to see you mike give my love to amira uh if you want to know about those trips around the world when's your neck where are

[02:17:19] you going next we got two mexico city experiences after the oaxaca one and then it's on to our first tuscany experience i mentioned this before in the show um this is our 10th anniversary for the gastronomatic experiences and so we're going doing all kinds of really great stuff one of them is the tuscany experience we're going to have a couple of other new locations uh that are super excited but exciting but

[02:17:43] uh we love just we all we do every single day all day is the funnest life-changing food related things wine related things you could possibly keep your weight down to a reason i know it kills me i would love that job but i'd weigh 400 pounds if i did it kills me it's uh it's you know i've been trying i've been working on that lately i i have to figure out how to sort of fast and all that stuff between experiences but yeah there's so much food so much really really good food on these experiences and

[02:18:12] i will i will give you an endorsement because lisa and i went on they're small groups a few couple handful of couples four five six couples uh they're great people often twit listeners and uh and you're gonna get it get the best possible travel experience really getting to know the area the local and the food and wine and beverages we were we drank a lot of mezcal when we were in oaxaca and learned a lot about

[02:18:37] how it was made went to a pulque bar and danced it was so much fun uh it is if you if you really want to travel not be a tourist but travel uh mike and amira know the the regions and know how to put together an amazing experience the gastronomatic experience gastronomad.net mike also has a newsletter at machine society.ai that covers ai and he's very insightful i look forward to the new one the

[02:19:05] attachment economy that's going to be great um thank you leo don't forget hello chatterbox um which was mike's son's startup that's still going strong hello chatterbox.com it's ai for people who want a private ai i want to understand it for his schools it's a safe playground for kids to learn about these incredible devices that is they're for sure going to be a part of their future

[02:19:35] and understand it and not then demystify it uh hello chatterbox.com and uh have i plugged everything is there anything left i'd like to give you all the plugs that's that's all that's all thank you so much for those plugs well thank you i really really appreciate it and and uh the one that i i really want everybody to sign up

[02:19:57] for as machine society because all the other things that i'm involved with uh have uh have links and and and information in that newsletter so it's free awesome can be free as a paid version but thank you for all those plugs leo i really appreciate it my pleasure i forgot to ask you lou does uh did paul paul allen owned the seahawks right that was his yeah he did yeah yeah this is a state still on or did

[02:20:23] that they sell that off i don't know i don't know either yeah his sister might own his sister runs the estate now um so now see i am torn geographically i would root for the patriots and geographically i'm supposed to hate the seahawks but on the other hand i like paul allen he used to own uh tech tv larry maggot it's uh it's coming up safer internet day and connect safely.org is going to have a bunch of

[02:20:52] events you can watch the streams on tuesday you're going to do an event in sacramento in person yeah we're going to have lots of kids lots of legislators lots of tech executives put the tech executives and the kids in the legislature's legislators at one table and they can have it out and talk about all the things they want to see changed and see what happens i am going to have to watch that because uh this is a debate i'm having internally i mean and we have on many of the shows i mean i don't know what the right thing is so well it's hard to know i mean this is the

[02:21:21] internet is as we've talked about on the show changing dramatically as we speak and things that you know i've had to evolve some of my views in in various ways because things have changed and there are new risks you know i've written i've been writing about the internet since 1984 i wrote a book called the electronic link in 1984 and please forgive me for not having anything in there about nation states using the internet to uh control other nations elections we didn't know there's so much i didn't

[02:21:49] know i feel like i have to atone frankly for how you don't no one knew everybody i mean i was around then talking about it too and we all thought this is going to be the greatest thing ever yeah and it is in many ways i mean we were wrong it's just we didn't know what hazards would also we couldn't anticipate some of the risks but then we couldn't anticipate some of the benefits as well and i'm still bullish i mean believe it or not despite a lot of things i'm still optimistic and

[02:22:15] i'm still every day i log on and do productive things that i couldn't have done for the first 50 years of my life and you know and i'm happy about that but imagine your life without the internet it's not hard to believe it's happened when the internet goes down when my my you know the other night all of a sudden netflix started buffering and i had to reboot my modem my router

[02:22:38] and i had no connectivity for 10 whole minutes how did you survive uh there'd be no twit without the internet that's for sure uh i would probably be working at some dingy radio station somewhere if it still exists you could have been well if it weren't for the internet newspapers and radio would still be alive yeah remember wcbs one of the the the yes the flagship cbs station it doesn't

[02:23:05] exist anymore doesn't exist i grew up listening wcbs anyway but it's uh thanks for it and by the way as long as we're plugging our kids balkan bump is my son's trade name oh what is balkan but it's a band it's it's it's kind of a project he calls it it's it's um you go to the website and they're performing all over the world although he's taking he's not performing as much as he used to because he's got a young child now but looks like he's got some tourist dates coming up and he was on the super

[02:23:32] bowl a couple of super bowls ago and super bowl 2020 got him through the pen so you you believe it or not you've been watching a show with two people with kids and super bowl ads unless maybe more if mike and lou have been doing anything i didn't know about i don't know not yet um can i can i play a little balkan bump music is it balkan it's balkan inspired i love love balkan music actually yeah

[02:24:00] balkan um where where is the where is there is there any music i oh i think oh there is somewhere i think links are up top there's a youtube button oh oh that works too this is called prayer song oh i'm gonna listen to this is there is there singing or is it all instrumental you know i can't remember on this one um he's got a new album out so this may be his premise this is the new album i haven't even heard it yet so you're hearing it for the first time wow

[02:24:29] nice check it out you know he said i love it and by the way the funny story you love this he was kicked off facebook for a while for violating his own copyright of course luckily he has a dad who who knows people so we got him back on right of course how how unsurprising thank you larry thank

[02:24:53] you leo we had larry lou leo and mike on this show thank you guys really appreciate it a special thanks to our club twit members who make this show possible lisa just told me this month club twit members supported us 33 of our operating expenses one-third of our operating expenses came from the club that really tells you something without you we would not be able to do what we do so thank you and if you're not a member of the club i really want to encourage you to join twit.tv

[02:25:20] slash club twit you get ad-free versions of all the shows access to the club twit discord which is a great hang all the special programming we do in the club like yesterday's or i guess it was friday's ai user group which was so interesting uh twit.tv slash club please we'd love to have you in the club i'd love to see you in club twit uh we do twit go ahead i'm sorry i'm sorry leo can i can i plug

[02:25:45] club twit just a little bit yes my own my own plug i really am bothered by podcasts that give you three quarters of the podcast and say if you want to listen to the rest of the podcast you got to pay right what you're doing with club twit is like you you you're giving everybody all the podcasts right and right if you join the club you're supporting it there's some unique programming and so on but but this is the right way to do it so one of the reasons to support club twit

[02:26:13] is because you want to reward the podcasters who are monetizing in the right way not in an exploitative way not in a sort of not in a kind of a uh a negative way like some of the podcasters are doing so you should reward the good podcasters i appreciate that yeah we i never wanted a paywall i really believe that what we do should be available to everyone for free and it is free it's ad

[02:26:37] supported uh for free but if you want to support what we do and don't want to hear the ads uh join the club and uh and yeah i think that's a good point uh mike even the stuff that we do in the club you can watch as we do it and then a month after we do it is available to the general public sometimes sooner so yeah that's that's a thank you i appreciate that we you were the one who told me that what we do is democrat democratizing because we anybody can listen what a contest that's always been

[02:27:05] important yeah yeah thank you mike appreciate it thank you all for being here we do twit every sunday normally it's a 1400 pacific time 17 uh east coast time 2200 utc you can watch us live club member or not if you're in the club you can watch in the discord but even even the club members often watch on youtube or twitch or x or facebook or linkedin or kick we're on all of those live chatting with you live on all of

[02:27:32] those after the fact on demand versions of the show audio or video available at the website twit.tv there's a youtube channel with a video great way to share clips if you would that'd be great tell the world about uh the best technology podcast in the world in my humble opinion uh there's also of course uh it's a podcast so there's uh the opportunity to subscribe and it's free i hate the word subscribe because it sounds like you pay for it no it's free uh just pick up a podcast client

[02:28:01] appels is fine uh uh pocket casts overcast there's many of them and subscribe that way you'll get it automatically audio or video the minute we've polished it up thanks to our technical uh editor and producer um mr benito gonzalez kevin king who does the editing thanks to all of you for joining us we will see you next time another twit is in the can go patriots go seahawks