Could Hybrid Tech Help Greener Planes Take Off?

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[00:00:13] [SPEAKER_01]: more at ScienceCertified.com. Welcome to Tech News Briefing. It's Thursday, August 29th.

[00:00:23] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm Zoe Thomas for the Wall Street Journal. An evaluation of more than 1,500 climate policies

[00:00:30] [SPEAKER_01]: in 41 countries found that less than 5% were actually effective at reducing greenhouse gas

[00:00:37] [SPEAKER_01]: emissions. What's going on? Our reporter Eric Nehler will join us to explain.

[00:00:43] [SPEAKER_01]: And sticking with environmental concerns, the aviation industry is responsible for about 2%

[00:00:49] [SPEAKER_01]: of greenhouse gas emissions. It set a goal of zero emissions by 2050. Could hybrid planes

[00:00:56] [SPEAKER_01]: be the solution to meet that? We're starting with a study that found most climate policies

[00:01:08] [SPEAKER_01]: in 41 countries don't work. That may sound bleak, but the findings did highlight how nations

[00:01:15] [SPEAKER_01]: can develop strategies that actually do cut emissions. Here to tell us more is our reporter

[00:01:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Eric Nehler. So Eric, this study was published last week in the journal Science. Describe to

[00:01:27] [SPEAKER_01]: how it worked. How did researchers arrive at these results? This was a study that looked at a big

[00:01:34] [SPEAKER_02]: database of climate policies that are compiled by the Organization for Economic Cooperation and

[00:01:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Development. That's a Paris-based economic agency that has been looking at these trends

[00:01:46] [SPEAKER_02]: of policies for the past, say, 25 years or so. And so in using an AI or machine learning

[00:01:54] [SPEAKER_02]: algorithm, it was able to sort of sift through this big database and connect them, cross-reference

[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_02]: them to stated reductions in emissions of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases from each of

[00:02:07] [SPEAKER_02]: these countries. There were 41 countries in the study and there were over 1,500 policies

[00:02:13] [SPEAKER_01]: that were examined. Eric, can you give us a little background? When did a lot of these policies

[00:02:18] [SPEAKER_02]: come about? Most of these policies have come about since 2015 when more than 190 countries

[00:02:24] [SPEAKER_02]: signed the Paris Agreement, a big global treaty for these nations to limit their carbon emissions

[00:02:31] [SPEAKER_02]: to a level that would keep global warming from rising 1.5 degrees above pre-industrial levels.

[00:02:38] [SPEAKER_01]: So 63 out of 1,500 policies worked. That's less than 5%. What did these policies that did

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_02]: work have in common? Well, what these policies that did work had in common was to really combine

[00:02:52] [SPEAKER_02]: a couple of economic tools. It could have been a subsidy combined with a tax, you know, a carrot

[00:02:59] [SPEAKER_02]: and a stick, for example. Maybe you had an incentive to purchase a greener car but you also

[00:03:06] [SPEAKER_02]: had higher taxes on some kind of fuel that went into this car that would make it much

[00:03:12] [SPEAKER_02]: better deal for the consumer. It could have been restricting fuels and power plants but also

[00:03:18] [SPEAKER_02]: offering some kind of subsidies or tax incentives to companies that own these power plants.

[00:03:24] [SPEAKER_01]: How much did the policies that were working reduce emissions by? The 63 successful policy

[00:03:30] [SPEAKER_02]: interventions reduced emissions between 0.6 billion and 1.8 billion metric tons of

[00:03:36] [SPEAKER_02]: carbon dioxide. The most successful ones, of course, used a mixture of policy tools.

[00:03:41] [SPEAKER_02]: In the U.S., for example, emissions from vehicles dropped 8% from 2008 to 2010 after new mileage

[00:03:48] [SPEAKER_02]: rules were put into effect in 2007 along with a tax break for motorists who bought cleaner cars

[00:03:54] [SPEAKER_01]: in 2006. What does this study tell us about what's more effective at reducing emissions,

[00:03:59] [SPEAKER_02]: new technologies or economic subsidies? I spoke with Nicholas Koch. He's a senior researcher

[00:04:05] [SPEAKER_02]: at the Berlin-based Mercator Research Institute and he says the commonality in these cases

[00:04:10] [SPEAKER_02]: is where subsidies and regulations are combined with price-based policy instruments. That means

[00:04:16] [SPEAKER_02]: that you really can't just assume that a new technology is going to work. You've got to have

[00:04:21] [SPEAKER_02]: some other incentives, some ways to either for companies to adopt new technologies or for

[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_02]: consumers to adopt these technologies as well. So by putting a couple of things together,

[00:04:32] [SPEAKER_02]: you've seen bends and little kinks in the emissions curve that they can have a direct

[00:04:37] [SPEAKER_02]: attribution to that pricing tool or that tax or subsidy. That was WSJ reporter Eric Kneeler.

[00:04:45] [SPEAKER_01]: All right, after the break, hybrid planes could help the aviation industry reduce

[00:04:50] [SPEAKER_01]: its greenhouse gas emissions. We'll tell you how hybrids get around some of the challenges

[00:04:56] [SPEAKER_01]: of all-electric flying when we come back. With Ecolab Science Certified, we take cleaning

[00:05:06] [SPEAKER_00]: off your plate so you can focus on what's most important to your restaurant, your guests,

[00:05:10] [SPEAKER_00]: and having them switch from giving your restaurant a go to making it a go-to spot.

[00:05:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Ecolab Science Certified. Count on a scientific clean. Learn more at sciencecertified.com.

[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_01]: You've probably heard of, or maybe you've even driven, a hybrid car, one that uses gas

[00:05:32] [SPEAKER_01]: and electric power. Well what about a hybrid plane? It's the same general idea, and it

[00:05:39] [SPEAKER_01]: could help get the aviation industry flying greener while it works to make fully electric

[00:05:44] [SPEAKER_01]: planes a reality. Here to tell us more is Sean Captain, who wrote about this for the

[00:05:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Wall Street Journal. So Sean, what are some of the big challenges or limitations

[00:05:54] [SPEAKER_03]: of battery-powered planes? Yeah, it's a lot harder to run a plane on batteries.

[00:05:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Some obvious reasons, for example, you can't land every hundred miles to recharge. So

[00:06:03] [SPEAKER_03]: you're really limited on the range. Batteries pack far less energy per pound than fuel does,

[00:06:09] [SPEAKER_03]: like kerosene fuel, which most airplanes fly on. What electric planes are close to coming to

[00:06:15] [SPEAKER_03]: market now? So there are some all-electric planes that run just on battery. They're being looked

[00:06:21] [SPEAKER_03]: at for things like air taxis, something you take around town or maybe from downtown to the

[00:06:25] [SPEAKER_03]: airport, maybe 50 miles or less. Those fully electric ones that run just on battery,

[00:06:29] [SPEAKER_03]: you're looking at like four passengers. They could be coming to market in the next two years,

[00:06:35] [SPEAKER_03]: but they've got very limited range. You're looking at most 100 miles, probably less. If

[00:06:39] [SPEAKER_03]: you want to start getting several hundred miles, you're going to need to supplement the electric

[00:06:44] [SPEAKER_01]: power with some form of gas power. Let's talk about the approaches for hybrid planes. A basic

[00:06:51] [SPEAKER_01]: hybrid car has one engine that combines combustion and electric power. How could this

[00:06:56] [SPEAKER_03]: approach be adapted to a plane? That's one of the approaches being taken. There's a company

[00:07:01] [SPEAKER_03]: called AmpAir that we covered that's really doing that. The two are essentially connected

[00:07:05] [SPEAKER_03]: together kind of like in a Prius. They are using it, in this case, you need a lot less

[00:07:11] [SPEAKER_03]: energy to move a plane when it's cruising, when it's in most of its flight. So they're able to

[00:07:16] [SPEAKER_03]: run a smaller combustion engine for the majority of the flight and then they just kick

[00:07:21] [SPEAKER_03]: in the electric power when they need a little more power save for takeoff and landing.

[00:07:25] [SPEAKER_03]: So essentially you're not carrying around a big heavy powerful engine that you only need for

[00:07:30] [SPEAKER_01]: a tiny portion of the flight. And what would the emissions savings be for these kinds of planes?

[00:07:36] [SPEAKER_03]: They're looking at somewhere around 50% savings, mainly because they're running a smaller engine

[00:07:41] [SPEAKER_03]: that's burning less fuel. Now there are other ways to do this as well. Another approach is

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_03]: simply to have two different kinds of engines. So you've got two propellers on a particular

[00:07:50] [SPEAKER_03]: plane we're looking at from a company called Hart that are running on traditional, what they

[00:07:55] [SPEAKER_03]: call, turboprop engines and then two that are running on electric. And they can trade off

[00:07:59] [SPEAKER_01]: those two to save energy that way. NASA is also working towards this. Can you tell us what it's

[00:08:05] [SPEAKER_03]: doing? Yeah, NASA is actually paralleling some of the operations we're seeing totally with

[00:08:09] [SPEAKER_03]: private companies. They've got one plane that essentially does what I just mentioned with

[00:08:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Hart where they've retrofitted an old passenger plane that kept the two turbine engines

[00:08:20] [SPEAKER_03]: and then they've added two electric engines from a company called Magni X. Then they also

[00:08:25] [SPEAKER_03]: are testing a combination engine where you have the gas and the electric engine in one unit

[00:08:31] [SPEAKER_03]: and they're testing that on an old Saab airplane that seats about 30 people. Another approach to

[00:08:39] [SPEAKER_01]: a hybrid plane is called a series hybrid. How would that work? That's an interesting idea

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_03]: that also comes from automotive. In fact, one of the first electric cars that GM put out

[00:08:49] [SPEAKER_03]: in the 2000s ran on this principle, which is you run on batteries as long as you can

[00:08:54] [SPEAKER_03]: and then you actually switch to a generator that's run by a combustion engine. The idea there is

[00:09:01] [SPEAKER_03]: you can run on only electric motors which has a huge advantage. If you want to add a propeller

[00:09:07] [SPEAKER_03]: to an airplane, typically you've got to put a whole turbine engine for every single propeller.

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_03]: If you're running all electric, all you need to add another propeller is basically a small

[00:09:16] [SPEAKER_03]: electric motor. So instead of having one or two engines on a plane, you could have six,

[00:09:23] [SPEAKER_03]: eight, ten, up to 30. The idea is you get much better airflow over the wings, you get better lift,

[00:09:29] [SPEAKER_03]: you get better control, you get a lot of efficiencies by doing it that way.

[00:09:32] [SPEAKER_01]: How far along are these efforts? When might somebody be actually flying in a hybrid plane?

[00:09:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Several companies are looking to get planes in the air before the end of the decade,

[00:09:43] [SPEAKER_03]: principally by retrofitting older planes. So you're taking like a Cessna, for instance,

[00:09:48] [SPEAKER_03]: that has already been flown for a year, it's already been approved, it's already a well-known

[00:09:52] [SPEAKER_03]: plane and you're electrifying it. So you still have to test it out and get FAA or whatever

[00:09:59] [SPEAKER_03]: agency approval for that new configuration but the idea is it's a lot easier than building a

[00:10:04] [SPEAKER_03]: new plane from scratch. So we're seeing that for instance with AmpAir which is projecting

[00:10:08] [SPEAKER_03]: to get something in the air by 2028. We're seeing it with another company called Whisper

[00:10:13] [SPEAKER_03]: which builds electric jet engines and they're saying 2029 or so within about five years.

[00:10:19] [SPEAKER_01]: What other solutions for developing greener planes are being explored?

[00:10:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Well one way that electric could go a lot further is with what's known as a fuel cell. It's

[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_03]: a little bit like a battery in that it takes energy from a chemical reaction and converts

[00:10:33] [SPEAKER_03]: into electrical energy. Those could travel quite a bit further but it's questionable

[00:10:39] [SPEAKER_03]: those are going to happen or not. Airbus is working the most on that and they are considering

[00:10:44] [SPEAKER_03]: 100 passenger, 1000 mile range plane and they're doing some work on it but they also told me

[00:10:49] [SPEAKER_03]: that they may abandon it. They're going to decide in the next year or not if it's worth

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_01]: doing. All right Sean Captain thanks for bringing us this story. Anytime. And that's

[00:10:57] [SPEAKER_01]: it for tech news briefing. Today's show was produced by Zoe Kolkin with supervising producer

[00:11:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Catherine Millsop. I'm Zoe Thomas for the Wall Street Journal. We'll be back this afternoon

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_01]: with TNB Tech Minute. Thanks for listening. With Ecolab Science Certified we take cleaning off

[00:11:19] [SPEAKER_00]: your plate so you can focus on what's most important to your restaurant, your guests,

[00:11:23] [SPEAKER_00]: and having them switch from giving your restaurant a go to making it a go-to spot.

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Ecolab Science Certified. Count on a scientific clean. Learn more at sciencecertified.com.