Joannabot Answers Your Questions About the iPhone 16

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[00:00:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to Tech News Briefing.

[00:00:20] [SPEAKER_01]: It's Friday, September 20th.

[00:00:22] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm Zoe Thomas for The Wall Street Journal.

[00:00:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Make way for the new executive power move using low-tech gadgets.

[00:00:30] [SPEAKER_01]: We'll tell you why being less reachable is a flex and who can pull it off.

[00:00:37] [SPEAKER_01]: And then, our senior personal tech columnist Joanna Stern has reviewed iPhones for over

[00:00:43] [SPEAKER_01]: a decade.

[00:00:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Now she's handing off the job to generative artificial intelligence.

[00:00:48] [SPEAKER_01]: The real Joanna will join us to explain why and tell us what she thinks of the answers

[00:00:53] [SPEAKER_01]: provided by Joannabot.

[00:00:58] [SPEAKER_01]: But first, are you fed up of hearing your phone beep all the time?

[00:01:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Tired of your watch vibrating?

[00:01:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Do you just want a break from all your screens?

[00:01:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, so do executives.

[00:01:11] [SPEAKER_01]: And our on-the-clock columnist Callum Borshers is here to tell us how some bosses are pulling

[00:01:16] [SPEAKER_01]: back from high tech.

[00:01:18] [SPEAKER_01]: So Callum, what has made the use of low-tech or older tech devices such a status symbol?

[00:01:24] [SPEAKER_00]: It's the novelty, right?

[00:01:25] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, if I flashback 15 or 20 years when people had their BlackBerrys, that was the

[00:01:29] [SPEAKER_00]: status symbol, right?

[00:01:30] [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, you're so important that you would have to be reachable anywhere, anytime.

[00:01:34] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, now basically all of us are.

[00:01:36] [SPEAKER_00]: That's not special.

[00:01:37] [SPEAKER_00]: That's not impressive anymore.

[00:01:38] [SPEAKER_00]: What I'm hearing from some managers that actually the real flex is to say, you know what, I'm

[00:01:42] [SPEAKER_00]: important enough that I can make other people wait.

[00:01:45] [SPEAKER_00]: And this has carried over into use of things like fax machines and dumb phones.

[00:01:49] [SPEAKER_00]: It's really interesting.

[00:01:50] [SPEAKER_01]: What are some of the other practical benefits according to the folks you spoke to?

[00:01:53] [SPEAKER_00]: The big one is minimizing distractions.

[00:01:55] [SPEAKER_00]: We all know that it can be a huge time suck to spend scrolling through your inbox, doom

[00:02:00] [SPEAKER_00]: scrolling on social media.

[00:02:02] [SPEAKER_00]: If you don't have a smartphone, for example, you're not going to fall into that trap.

[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_00]: One example would be somebody like the chief executive of DIFF, which is an online retail

[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_00]: software maker, by the way.

[00:02:12] [SPEAKER_00]: So not exactly a Luddite here and not a geezer, right?

[00:02:15] [SPEAKER_00]: The CEO is 41 years old.

[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_00]: His name is Ben Crudo, but he uses a dumb phone.

[00:02:18] [SPEAKER_00]: And he says, look, what it means is that I have to be very disciplined about when I'm

[00:02:22] [SPEAKER_00]: in my inbox.

[00:02:23] [SPEAKER_00]: So I check email only from my computer, not on a mobile device.

[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_00]: And I have designated times.

[00:02:28] [SPEAKER_00]: I check at 9, noon, 3 and 6.

[00:02:30] [SPEAKER_00]: And that's it.

[00:02:31] [SPEAKER_00]: And aside from that, it can wait or if it truly can't wait, call me.

[00:02:35] [SPEAKER_00]: You can reach me on my phone with an old fashioned phone call, but I'm not going to be tethered

[00:02:39] [SPEAKER_00]: to the device at all times.

[00:02:40] [SPEAKER_01]: Are there cases where the low tech solution being used is almost the opposite of the business

[00:02:45] [SPEAKER_01]: that these people are running?

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_00]: I just think you can't beat the irony of Michael Linton, who is the chairman of Snap, which

[00:02:51] [SPEAKER_00]: is known for making a messaging service that disappears into thin air.

[00:02:55] [SPEAKER_00]: And he loves fax machines, paper and ink.

[00:02:58] [SPEAKER_00]: It's like totally the opposite.

[00:02:59] [SPEAKER_00]: But this sort of traces back to his time as the chief executive at Sony, which of course

[00:03:03] [SPEAKER_00]: had a big cyber attack 10 years ago.

[00:03:06] [SPEAKER_00]: And he said, look, he liked faxes even before then, but it really reinforced for him the

[00:03:10] [SPEAKER_00]: cybersecurity aspect of the paper and ink fax machine.

[00:03:13] [SPEAKER_00]: He said, look, you can't hack my fax, or at least I don't think you can hack it as easily

[00:03:16] [SPEAKER_00]: as you could my emails.

[00:03:18] [SPEAKER_00]: I've heard that from some other executives as well.

[00:03:20] [SPEAKER_00]: And he also said, you know, the reality is people get so many emails these days that

[00:03:25] [SPEAKER_00]: it's easy to get buried in somebody's inbox when you're trying to get their attention.

[00:03:28] [SPEAKER_00]: If you send them a fax, it might be the only one they receive this week or maybe this decade.

[00:03:33] [SPEAKER_00]: You have to give them a heads up, right?

[00:03:34] [SPEAKER_00]: They may not be checking that fax machine otherwise.

[00:03:36] [SPEAKER_00]: But he told me he's sort of reluctantly having to wean himself off the habit because fewer

[00:03:40] [SPEAKER_00]: and fewer people even have the machines to receive them.

[00:03:43] [SPEAKER_01]: What about using old tech to kind of look cool?

[00:03:46] [SPEAKER_00]: There is a certain style to this, almost like the tech version of quiet luxury, right?

[00:03:50] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going for flashy.

[00:03:52] [SPEAKER_00]: It's the same kind of thing.

[00:03:53] [SPEAKER_00]: The newest thing is I'm going to go low tech and oh, by the way, people who are in the

[00:03:57] [SPEAKER_00]: know know that they can still be kind of pricey.

[00:04:00] [SPEAKER_00]: You think about the light phone, which is stripped down.

[00:04:03] [SPEAKER_00]: It's not pure dumb phone, but definitely a minimal phone.

[00:04:06] [SPEAKER_00]: The newest version goes on sale next year at $799, which by the way, is the same starting

[00:04:11] [SPEAKER_00]: price for the newly unveiled iPhone 16, if you can believe that.

[00:04:15] [SPEAKER_00]: So it's not necessarily about being cheap.

[00:04:17] [SPEAKER_01]: All right, that was our columnist Callum Borshers.

[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_01]: Coming up, got questions about the iPhone 16?

[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_01]: We've got an AI bot with answers.

[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_01]: That's after the break.

[00:04:34] [SPEAKER_02]: With Ecolab Science Certified, we take cleaning off your plate so you can focus on what's

[00:04:38] [SPEAKER_02]: most important to your restaurant, your guests, and having them switch from giving your restaurant

[00:04:42] [SPEAKER_02]: a go to making it a go-to spot.

[00:04:44] [SPEAKER_02]: Ecolab Science Certified.

[00:04:45] [SPEAKER_02]: Count on the scientific clean.

[00:04:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Learn more at sciencecertified.com.

[00:04:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Every September, as the leaves start to change colors and kids head back to school, our senior

[00:04:59] [SPEAKER_01]: personal tech columnist Joanna Stern reviews the latest iPhones.

[00:05:04] [SPEAKER_01]: This year, with Apple getting in on the generative AI revolution, Joanna decided to try something

[00:05:10] [SPEAKER_01]: a little different.

[00:05:11] [SPEAKER_01]: With the help of engineer Brian Witten and others, she created a generative AI buddy

[00:05:17] [SPEAKER_01]: called JoannaBot to help with your iPhone 16 questions.

[00:05:21] [SPEAKER_01]: And the real Joanna is here to tell us about it.

[00:05:24] [SPEAKER_01]: So Joanna, why did you decide to create JoannaBot?

[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, three reasons.

[00:05:29] [SPEAKER_03]: The first is that this whole iPhone review process is getting to be a little bit like

[00:05:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Groundhog Day.

[00:05:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Every year I review the phone.

[00:05:37] [SPEAKER_03]: I've been doing this for 10 years plus now.

[00:05:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And over the last few years, the phones have really not changed much.

[00:05:44] [SPEAKER_03]: And I do find myself writing a lot of the same things year after year.

[00:05:49] [SPEAKER_03]: Sure, there are slight camera differences, better battery life.

[00:05:53] [SPEAKER_03]: There's only so many ways to put that in a really nice and succinct and clever way for

[00:06:00] [SPEAKER_03]: readers.

[00:06:01] [SPEAKER_03]: The second reason is that traditional reviews have always tried to answer a lot of questions.

[00:06:07] [SPEAKER_03]: And sometimes you might not find that answer in what we usually is around 1,000 to 1,200

[00:06:13] [SPEAKER_03]: words.

[00:06:14] [SPEAKER_03]: And so this is more open-ended.

[00:06:16] [SPEAKER_03]: People can come in and ask really any question they want about iPhones.

[00:06:20] [SPEAKER_03]: And then third, since Apple is now all about AI, why not make the review AI?

[00:06:28] [SPEAKER_01]: So what was the methodology for building JoannaBot?

[00:06:30] [SPEAKER_03]: The way we built this is it is using Google's Gemini large language model.

[00:06:37] [SPEAKER_03]: And we then told the bot with programming and prompts that it was only to answer things

[00:06:44] [SPEAKER_03]: based on a certain body of text.

[00:06:47] [SPEAKER_03]: And that body of text was really compiled of three things.

[00:06:51] [SPEAKER_03]: The first thing was my past reviews of the iPhones.

[00:06:54] [SPEAKER_03]: The second thing we gave it was iPhone specs from Apple's website so that it just had those

[00:06:59] [SPEAKER_03]: firm specs of cameras and screen sizes and colors.

[00:07:03] [SPEAKER_03]: And then the third was something that we didn't know we would need.

[00:07:07] [SPEAKER_03]: I ended up writing a long document for just the bot, which we called internally the sort

[00:07:13] [SPEAKER_03]: of the Bible, the iPhone review Bible, that just had my most important facts and feelings,

[00:07:21] [SPEAKER_03]: everything that I know about covering Apple and covering and reviewing iPhones and what

[00:07:26] [SPEAKER_03]: you should really think about when upgrading.

[00:07:29] [SPEAKER_03]: So we took all of this text.

[00:07:30] [SPEAKER_03]: It's a lot of text.

[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_03]: We gave it to the system and said, this is what you know.

[00:07:35] [SPEAKER_03]: You should only answer questions about this body of text.

[00:07:39] [SPEAKER_03]: What we're seeing is that the bot can get things wrong.

[00:07:42] [SPEAKER_03]: It can hallucinate like other generative AI bots, but for the most part, it's getting things right.

[00:07:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, let's test out Joannabot.

[00:07:50] [SPEAKER_01]: And listeners of course can head over to wsj.com slash joannabot if they want to do this themselves.

[00:07:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Joanna, let's start with an easy question for Joannabot.

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Is Siri any better on the iPhone 16?

[00:08:07] [SPEAKER_01]: All right, I've got Siri has been redesigned on the iPhone 16.

[00:08:11] [SPEAKER_01]: It has a more natural voice and can better understand you if you flub or change your

[00:08:16] [SPEAKER_01]: query mid-sentence.

[00:08:17] [SPEAKER_01]: It can also answer questions about your Apple products and their system settings.

[00:08:23] [SPEAKER_01]: It adds, however, the iPhone 16 model will come with iOS 18 in September, but this software

[00:08:29] [SPEAKER_01]: version does not include Apple intelligence features.

[00:08:33] [SPEAKER_03]: I want to give like a giant round of applause to the bot there.

[00:08:36] [SPEAKER_03]: I get so happy when the bot gets something so right and is exactly what I would have said

[00:08:41] [SPEAKER_03]: because not only the spec sheet, but the marketing from Apple will tell you that the new iPhone

[00:08:46] [SPEAKER_03]: 16 has this better Siri.

[00:08:49] [SPEAKER_03]: It has Apple intelligence, but that second paragraph tells you, hey, not so fast.

[00:08:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Keep in mind that Apple intelligence, which is what the Siri is included in, doesn't come

[00:08:58] [SPEAKER_03]: out till later, till iOS 18.1.

[00:09:01] [SPEAKER_03]: That's going to be in October.

[00:09:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, let's try something maybe a little more personal.

[00:09:06] [SPEAKER_01]: This question actually comes from our producer, Julie Chang.

[00:09:09] [SPEAKER_01]: She wants to know, should she upgrade her iPhone 11 since she spilled soda on it?

[00:09:16] [SPEAKER_03]: I want to see what I get.

[00:09:19] [SPEAKER_03]: So the answer here, the first line is that's a sticky situation with a weird emoji face.

[00:09:26] [SPEAKER_03]: See, funny, funny bot, funny bot.

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_03]: And then it says while the iPhone 16 is the newest model, it's important to consider whether

[00:09:32] [SPEAKER_03]: you need an upgrade.

[00:09:33] [SPEAKER_03]: The iPhone 11 is still supported by Apple and can run the latest iOS 18 software.

[00:09:37] [SPEAKER_03]: That is true.

[00:09:37] [SPEAKER_03]: This includes a lot of new features.

[00:09:39] [SPEAKER_03]: Then it goes to the features.

[00:09:41] [SPEAKER_03]: If your iPhone 11 is still working, you might consider getting that soda damage repaired

[00:09:45] [SPEAKER_03]: instead of upgrading.

[00:09:46] [SPEAKER_03]: This is what I would have said.

[00:09:48] [SPEAKER_01]: You seem pretty positive about Joanna Bot's overall abilities.

[00:09:52] [SPEAKER_01]: I wonder what human Joanna's thoughts are on the iPhone 16 though.

[00:09:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Honestly, it's like a lot of what Joanna Bot said there, which is there's a lot of new features,

[00:10:01] [SPEAKER_03]: but it depends on what you're upgrading from.

[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_03]: If you ask if I've got an iPhone 15 Pro, it's going to tell you, like Joanna's advice is

[00:10:07] [SPEAKER_03]: you don't need to upgrade every year, that you still are going to have a very similar experience.

[00:10:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Joanna, there are several new versions of the iPhone 16 coming out.

[00:10:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Is there a reason to choose the Pro versions, which are a little more expensive?

[00:10:21] [SPEAKER_03]: One of my favorite things about the bot is that you can click to generate a chart that

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_03]: shows you the differences between the iPhone 16 and the iPhone 16 Pro.

[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_03]: I think it does a really good job of highlighting why there's a $200 gap between these two models.

[00:10:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I say in the test notes on the page that I always do prefer the Pro models.

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_03]: You're paying $200 for another camera, that zoom camera on the back.

[00:10:43] [SPEAKER_03]: You're also paying this year for better battery life and you get a better screen.

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Though I will say this year, those base models that start at $799 are very good and they

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_03]: give you some of the perks that you didn't usually get with the base model.

[00:10:56] [SPEAKER_03]: So now you have the action button, you have this new camera control, you're going to get

[00:11:00] [SPEAKER_03]: all the Apple intelligence stuff.

[00:11:02] [SPEAKER_01]: So will JoannaBot be answering questions about other products in the future?

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Wow, I feel like I'm now a tech executive.

[00:11:09] [SPEAKER_03]: I have to give my canned response of, well, we have a product roadmap that I can't share

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_03]: here today, but we're really excited about the potential of JoannaBot.

[00:11:18] [SPEAKER_01]: That was our senior personal tech columnist, Joanna Stern.

[00:11:22] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's it for Tech News Briefing.

[00:11:23] [SPEAKER_01]: Today's show was produced by Julie Chang.

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm your host, Zoe Thomas.

[00:11:28] [SPEAKER_01]: We had additional support this week from Trina Menino.

[00:11:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Jessica Fenton and Michael LaValle wrote our theme music.

[00:11:34] [SPEAKER_01]: Our supervising producer is Catherine Millsop.

[00:11:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Our development producer is Aisha Al-Muzlim.

[00:11:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Scott Salloway and Chris Zinsley are the deputy editors.

[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_01]: And Felana Patterson is The Wall Street Journal's head of news audio.

[00:11:46] [SPEAKER_01]: We'll be back this afternoon with TNB Tech Minute.

[00:11:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for listening.

[00:11:56] [SPEAKER_02]: With Ecolab Science Certified, we take cleaning off your plate so you can focus on what's most

[00:12:01] [SPEAKER_02]: important to your restaurant, your guests, and having them switch from giving your restaurant

[00:12:04] [SPEAKER_02]: a go to making it a go-to spot.

[00:12:07] [SPEAKER_02]: Ecolab Science Certified.

[00:12:08] [SPEAKER_02]: Count on the scientific clean.

[00:12:10] [SPEAKER_02]: Learn more at sciencecertified.com.