Mega MSPs: Friend or Foe? - EP70

Justin Esgar (00:07):

I am also recently now on Costco Food Talk, which is not a great TikTok trend to be on. I get a lot of people who, who buy the Costco hot dog and stuff it into the chicken bake and then wrap it with pizza and they're like all this for 3 99. I'm like, that's heartburn and diabetes all in one, all at the same time. What are you doing, man? You're like, I just want to have a colonoscopy. And I'm Costco

Eric Anthony (00:35):

Fan. In fact, I'm a Costco pizza fan.

Justin Esgar (00:39):

Are you? I'm not going to put it on there. I've never eaten food at Costco ever. Really? Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I've gotten food from Costco like the chicken, right? By the way. Basically a Costco, the double chocolate chip muffins, the six muffins. You get that you nuke it for 35 seconds and you open it up and the chocolate chip has become molten lava. And the amount of steam can give you an actual facial that with a glass of milk. I know it sounds childish, but I'm a man child, ear, ear. It's tonight's show.

Eric Anthony (01:23):

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Justin Esgar (02:13):

What's up everybody? Welcome to All Things MSP podcast. I'm your host Justin Esgar. With me always is my good friend. Late night podcast producer extraordinaire, Mr. Eric Anthony because due to timing, we're recording this later in the day than we normally do and you can't tell but it's dark outside. So I was actually going to crack open a high noon for this one and call this one ATM is B after Dark, but when this comes out, we will have already announced ACEs after dark as a thing. So I feel like I'm overusing the concept of after Dark, however correct, the best use of After Dark Ever is a tie between Baywatch After Dark when they made that spinoff show where David Hasselhoff was like a detective for no reason, lifeguard by day detective by night. I

Eric Anthony (03:01):

Do not remember

Justin Esgar (03:02):

That. They did not do well obviously. And then they did in Beverly Hills 9 0 2 1 oh the Peach Pit, which was the place they hung out Peach pit after dark. So at night the nerdy guy David ends up becoming like a dj I suppose by night. I do

Eric Anthony (03:19):

Remember

Justin Esgar (03:20):

That DJ by night. Yeah, I like the after dark moniker, but I've definitely been playing it into the ground recently.

Eric Anthony (03:34):

I mean I think I've used it once or twice, but not on a regular basis and it just doesn't fit the format.

Justin Esgar (03:45):

No, I did for ACEs After Dark, I went to chat GBTI gave up the ACEs logo and I said in my head I had this idea that the logo, we would just turn the logo dark and give some nice outline. I wanted to make a dark version of the logo, whatever it is. And so I told chat GBT, which they can now do images, Hey, take my logo and remake it so it has dark velvet curtains or this thing or whatever. And it just made me a completely new logo behind a black curtain. It's just like this black curtain that's peering open and then they're behind it. You just see random playing cards because it recognized the playing cards theme from the thing. But even though, so it random playing cards and you just see the C and the E and the word ACEs. I'm like, you've now just made it scantily clad. It's not a logo anymore.

Eric Anthony (04:42):

So by the way, I've had similar experiences with chat GPT trying to create images where I would give it my photo and say, here I want a cartoon version of this. It failed miserably

Justin Esgar (05:00):

Really, because I had this friend bent Levy out of LA and Ben has a public profile, he's written books or whatever, it's Chad gbt knew who he was, so I said, Hey, make me a cartoon picture of Ben Levy in front of, he really likes Porsches. So I was like, give me a cartoon picture of Ben Levy in front of a broken Porsche. And it did a pretty accurate portrayal of Ben. It clearly wasn't him, but it was close enough. He was in front of a Porsche. It just automatically put him in la. It knew he's in la and then the picture of Ben himself, he's holding a Mac laptop in one hand and a wrench in the other, and the Porsche just has wires coming out of it. It was hilarious. I laughed so hard. When you laugh and cough so hard at something, you actually rattle your brain from your brainstem and your head hurts for a little bit. That's how hard I was laughing in this photo when I first saw it with him.

Eric Anthony (06:08):

I still think that the best pictures I've ever gotten out of Chachi PT are the ones that I created that day. We were recording with Adam Angst and the

Justin Esgar (06:20):

Iron

Eric Anthony (06:20):

Man pirate.

Justin Esgar (06:23):

The thing is, I find that it's really good if you want to do something completely creative. So my 9-year-old Roman, right, he, he's obsessed with having cha EBT draw pictures of people eating mac and cheese. I don't know why. And so he wanted to do the first prompt, I'm trying to remember. It was like have a turtle eating mac and cheese while there's a teenage mutant Nja turtle in the background watching said turtle, eat mac and cheese, something like this. And so it made a cartoon picture of a turtle eating mac and cheese and it said it in New York, the Freedom Tower was in the background, so it was clearly in New York. And then it had a ninja turtle Drew Raphael, the woman with the red watching this turtle eat mac and cheese. Now the funny thing is if you look at this picture, and we'll put it in the show notes is Rafael is standing on top of a building watch, eating Mac cheese, watching the turtle eat mac and cheese. Normally in the cartoons they would be squatting on the edge of a building, but if you look at it to scale the turtle, Rafael is the size of the building,

Eric Anthony (07:34):

An optical illusion.

Justin Esgar (07:36):

And then from there it went nuts. Roman was like, make it in Atlantis. So we made it in Atlantis and then all of a sudden the turtles were flying and then we're like Add Poseidon. And then all of a sudden they were like 45 Ninja Turtles. We said, call them baby one Roman Esgar Jr. And the bowl just came up and it said Moment Esgar Jr. Because he can't do letters still for whatever reason. But yeah, if you need something super creative or you need ideas, I think to be honest, mid journey on Discord I think does a better job of the creative component than the image generator within chat EBT. Because I think the one in chat, EBT is Dolly, right? So I think Midjourney does a better job, but they both suck.

Eric Anthony (08:26):

Well, and I think it's partially, I want to know what some of the key prompts that I need to give Dolly chat, GPT, the directions for doing the pictures that I want because it will very often just randomly switch between photorealistic and something that looks,

Justin Esgar (08:51):

Oh, well, yeah, you have

Eric Anthony (08:52):

To tease versus something that looks,

Justin Esgar (08:56):

It's weird. So I'm working on a project right now. We're working on our second children's book. For those who don't know, I wrote a children's book with my wife called a very sneezy dinosaur elbow now on Amazon. And we did that one ourselves. Actually I wrote the book and I paid someone on Fiverr to do all the pictures and then Michelle put it all together and we made a book and self printed. And what's funny is the artist, the dinosaur throughout the book, the dinosaur stays the same, it's the same character across the book, but there are just varying differences depending on which page you're on. So in one page the dinosaur has freckles and the other page it doesn't, in one page there's a thing on its jacket and the next page is not, and I didn't even see any of this until well after we made the book.

(09:45):

And so we're working on our second one and I was smart enough to have chat, GBT, who's helping me write the book, read my final print and then say, and I said, make me the prompts for midjourney. So I have an entire separate document with the prompts the way it should read for the book. Now it did not give me directive, so it didn't say in a cartoon style or this or that, the other thing. So what I did was I went through with Chad, GBT and I said, I'm looking for, this is my first of many prompts. This is the style I'm writing, this is the book that I'm writing, this is what I want to do. And it gave me some options. And what I did was I named the final product. So it's a picture of a snake is the one that we're working now. And I said, okay, this snake is now known as Justin the snake. If I ever make a reference to any snake during this threat, always refer that back to Justin the snake, which is this snake. And it remembers that. So the next image I said when I pulled up the next one was like the snake is in the woods. It made not the exact snake snake, but something very similar, but it's kept the styling.

(11:11):

I was able to give it these, you have to forget the styling the first time and then you can shorthand it after. So you always want to do cartoon styling of a specific genre. I want everything to be Japanese anime looking. I just haven't played with it enough to, well, that's what everyone, I haven't played with it enough. I think the point is that you shouldn't have to play with it. I think the idea, and it's not there yet, which is obvious be it should be able to understand you, right? That's the idea. It's ai, it's supposed to be able to understand you. You shouldn't be having to give it so many. And I feel like that's where part of it is at loss. But then again, what do I know?

Eric Anthony (12:01):

Well, we should probably actually get onto an actual topic for

Justin Esgar (12:05):

This podcast. Oh, we have to do from the group.

Eric Anthony (12:08):

Oh, do we have to do it from Yes we do. We obviously have to do it from the group.

Justin Esgar (12:19):

Does anyone have a template or worksheet they use to help set up their pricing? We are working on redoing our pricing and I'm looking for a new framework to use. So this is you, Mr. Anonymous. Let us know Keith Nelson, top contributor Clutch Keith. I internally created our cost of service add burden rates, 25% contingency reserve, plus three keystone profit margin. This is the baseline. Then we start adding the value of our proposed services that we yield business outcomes. Add this to the baseline. I'm not really sure what Keith is saying here, to be honest. Here's what I would say about pricing and I think what this member is looking for,

(13:02):

All of us have our own pricing for what we consider managed services. There's certain things that we have to sell at the cost that we have to sell it. Microsoft licenses, Google licenses, Dropbox licenses, things like that. Those are usually set prices by the vendor. We get it as a discount as a reseller. And so then we can sell it. Cool. But for your own managed services, what your prices, it's determined by you and what you want to make. And then here, this reminds me of a story. When I first started out, when I first started in the business, I was charging somewhere like one 50 or 1 75 an hour, and I was charging like a hundred or $125 per device if they were going managed services. And I went to A BNI meeting as a guest. So for those who don't know, BNI is this international networking group.

(13:55):

And the idea is that there's one person from any particular industry at this to be a member of that particular group. And in New York City there's like 70 groups because it's so many people in such a tight area. And so I had somehow or other I was covering for someone because usually when you are a member, if you're going to be out, you can send someone as your replacement. So I went as a guest to this other group, New York Grand Central. And the format for the BNI meeting is everyone goes around a circle. You have one minute to say who you are, your elevator pitch, which they considered practice whatever. And then there's a little bit of SM bogie, and then there's usually someone who's doing a presentation for 20 minutes and then you network and then you leave. Okay? So I go around and because I was a guest, there was already an IT person. And this always got people, well, there's always an IT person in the group, but they do pc, I do mac, so it's different. And everyone's like, yeah, I guess so whatever.

(14:59):

And I happened to have been on the day the PC guy was giving his presentation. So during the minute round I go, hi, I'm Justin from virtual computers. We take care of clients who have Apple products everywhere from your grandma down to your entire business, whatever you need. If it's a computer or phone, whatever, we'll take care of it. And everyone was like, cool, nice. Thanks for being here. So then we sit down and now we're at the presentation point, and this PC MSP guy gets up and he's talking about the stuff that he does as an MSP. Now, keep in mind, this is 2008, 2009 era, and he's going on about what he says, and then he goes, and we do it all for low cost. Justin, what do you charge your clients? And I was like, $175 an hour or $125 a seat per month for taking care of all their stuff. He's like, that's crazy. We do it for $35 per user per month. And at that point I was like, ha. And I walked out,

Eric Anthony (16:07):

I can see you doing that.

Justin Esgar (16:08):

And I was like, how dare you. And I emailed the vice president of that group and I go, this is how you treat guests. That's really nice of you. And she's like, I'm so sorry. And of course I was like, I don't care, but

Eric Anthony (16:24):

Well, no, you don't care because you had such a leg up on that person because I'm sorry, you were way more profitable

Justin Esgar (16:34):

Than you were. Oh, I'm sure that guy's out of business. I'm a hundred percent sure.

Eric Anthony (16:36):

Right? And he's out of business now because of that. So bringing it back to this, I do kind of understand this because I've had conversations with Keith before on how he does his pricing. And basically what he's talking about is you need to add up the cost of all of what you expect your employees to spend time-wise, all of the individual costs, a 25% contingency, which that's kind of, you figure out what your contingency is going to be. I think based on the way Keith runs his business, he probably has a little bit higher contingency. The contingency. And by the way, I'm just going to point out here, the contingency is here so that when you find a better solution than the one that you're currently using in the stack to support that client, you can swap that tool out and not have to worry about it affecting your margin,

Justin Esgar (17:37):

The client's price or your markup. Yeah,

Eric Anthony (17:38):

Correct. And then you just correct at the next renewal rather than having to pull it on them as a surprise or having to take the hit. And then the other part of this is the value add, and that is what value are your services? And Keith does a lot of very specialized services. So he's talking about services that are actually going to yield additional dollars of revenue, additional dollars of profit to the client business, and therefore it drives more value than just a cost plus calculation.

Justin Esgar (18:22):

I'll tell you this going back our template is figure out your cogs. What does it cost to run your business per client? That's going to be your cost of your M-D-M-R-M-M. That's going to be the cost of any other added tools that you want to just include automatically. Some people include email protection, some people include antivirus and malware, things like that. Those are your cogs. And then go from there. I mean, in New York, when we acquired the company in Iowa in New York, we were charging somewhere around 180 5 a seat, 1 75, 180 5 a seat per month. And in Iowa he was charging closer to $85 a seat. And we can't jump Iowa prices to New York prices, right? No, at all. So I think that takes into account. I think you have to consider, and again, I don't know who wrote this, but you have to take into consider your cost of living and the kind of business you want to run because maybe we could charge 1 75, 180 5 in, and we only take on those big businesses that could afford it. There's not that many in Iowa. So we would be that more niche than if we did 1 25. So even our costs are variable depending on where we're at because it's just a different cost of living. Luckily, none of my clients listen to this show, so no one's going to come back to me and tell me I need to charge 'em less, but that's fine.

Eric Anthony (20:07):

So funny enough, I actually do, and I forgot that this was even here. I just remembered it while we were talking about it. I do have a simple price calculator that is in the group. So if you go to the group, you go to the files, there is a simple pricing calculator. I don't even know if it adheres to what I would tell you to do today,

Justin Esgar (20:31):

But it

Eric Anthony (20:31):

Is there. And I tell you what, I'm going to go back through this and

Justin Esgar (20:39):

Set it up and make it work. By the time this episode airs,

Eric Anthony (20:42):

Maybe

Justin Esgar (20:44):

Well anonymous member

Eric Anthony (20:47):

Promises,

Justin Esgar (20:49):

Right? You didn't post your name. So we're not going to post promises. Thanks for joining the group and we hope you figure out your pricing. If you do have questions, send a DM to Eric and I and that's from the group.

Eric Anthony (21:02):

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Justin Esgar (21:27):

The mega MSP.

Eric Anthony (21:29):

Yeah. So Rich Freeman, I think two weeks ago now actually published an article on this and it did create kind of a conversation in the group, which I thought was good.

(21:44):

I think mega MSPs are a blessing and a curse. Okay? I think that there is a component of the mega MSP that is an advantage to your average MSP in that they will never deliver services at a custom level down to the clients that the regular MSP serves. They just can't do it because it doesn't fit into their cost model. They'd have to charge way more than they want to charge because they're more of a commodity or they're dealing with larger clients and they're going to, according to the pumpkin plan, they're going to weed out the smaller clients. So there's always going to be a market for what the majority of MSPs do today.

Justin Esgar (22:41):

I think the mega MSPs, the difference between me and a mega MSP yes clients a hundred percent. It's also that white glove service. And not that a mega MSP couldn't do that, but at least the ones that I know of don't do that because they run the business. The way you run a restaurant, you need to have, they got to have turnover quickly in order to keep that business going. You do two and a half turns in an evening at a restaurant to make sure it's profitable. So instead of taking that extra 45 seconds to white glove a solution for a client, that technician at the mega MC needs to just move on to the next problem because they have exponentially more units to take care of and therefore they have exponentially more problems to deal with. They don't have time be on the phone and chitchat about your kid's soccer game or whatever they're in. They fix the machine, they're gone. But the other side of the coin of that is the clients that they're working with, right? If you look at any corporation that would need a mega MSP, that corporation wouldn't be hiring a two person MSP anyway.

Eric Anthony (24:15):

Correct.

Justin Esgar (24:16):

So I feel like it is a strange fight to say those guys are horrible, but sure they're horrible. Okay, big deal. It doesn't affect me, it doesn't affect my business. It's not affecting my clients directly. I mean maybe indirectly, however, there is one, I don't know if they're considered a mega MSP, but just there's one particular one and you know exactly who I'm talking about, and I'm not going to mention their name because I'm not giving them credit, but they come in and try to steal Apple clients from people like myself and a couple other members in the Facebook group because they do, and this kind of goes back to what we were talking about earlier, pricing models from the group. They come in and they swoop in with a lower price per machine, but they don't give that white glove service and then they don't hold up their end of the bargain. And then the client is now burned by them. They burn the bridge with me, and of course they're not going to come back because as much as people say clients come back, not in New York, they don't. Yeah, that's never happened. So they come in, they will be $75 a computer, they fail to do the thing, and then my client moves onto another one. So there is a point where a mega MSP, like the ones that's in this article by Rich could potentially do that to the smaller businesses if they had the capacity to deal with them or wanted to sign them on, get them for three months, screw it up and move on.

Eric Anthony (25:55):

So a couple of scenarios here. You have the MSP that I know you're talking about, shocking,

(26:07):

Who basically provide outsourced help desk. They're very bad at boots on the ground, so they can't really do much physically on premise. And most of what they do is just virtual over the phone remote session and it's a commodity based thing. And they can provide commodity based help desk to small businesses down to even one user. But again, it's going to lack either the white glove service that you're talking about or the solution base. We were talking about Keith Nelson, he offers solutions to his clients, not tech support, right? Tech support is part of the solution, but that's not really what Keith is offering. And it also goes to something that I actually did a podcast with Rich on. This is like the virtual CTO, because they're not going to do that. They're not going to be the virtual CIO, the virtual CTO, whatever you want to call it, fractional for that size client. Now they can go up to a larger client and do that, but they can't do it for smaller clients. And that's where I think the average MSP really has a shot at really good profitability is in providing those solutions rather than just the commodity because they can go buy the commodity someplace else.

(27:39):

What they can't buy is the expertise in the solution, design, engineering, that kind of thing.

Justin Esgar (27:47):

Because I think at that scale, they're trying to fit everything into the square hole,

Eric Anthony (27:53):

Correct.

Justin Esgar (27:54):

And truth be told, and there's a great TikTok if you follow this, you can actually fit all the pieces into the square hole. They're just not built for that. One of the funny things about this is on the Apple consultants locator page, there's a designation when you go there, the end user who's going there is supposed to choose their business size. It used to be one to 99 and they've recently changed this. Now there's one to nine, 10 to 99, 100 to 999 a thousand and above. So there's four designations.

(28:42):

If you choose a thousand plus, it immediately kicks you off to another website that has these giant MSP like enterprise firms. Apple won't even let you talk to a Apple themselves, won't let a company of a thousand people talk to a company like me. They still could find me and whatever, but if you follow the path that Apple set, it's done. So they've forced the hand for these enterprise level MSPs similar to these Meg MSPs. I, because it's me will fight that to be like, no, I can handle a thousand end users no problem. Even though I know I probably can't

Eric Anthony (29:43):

Not without scaling,

Justin Esgar (29:44):

I would try. Well, that's the other thing because while you were talking about it, I was thinking can't the tool set scale both directions? Because if you really think about it, going to the tech stack is mostly the same. You have an R-M-M-D-M tool, you have an antivirus, anti-malware tool, you have an email solution, you have an email backup solution, you have a computer backup solution, you have an email security solution pretty much base set. I tend to think that you can scale that better by using the same solution for everybody, right? Correct. I'm wondering why the mega MSPs, and I'm hoping not to come up with the answer because I don't want them coming after our clients, but I'm wondering why they can scale up, but they can't scale down using that same set. Because in theory and on paper, this is why I think I can handle a 1000 person company because I have my tech stack. It should work in either direction. It should work for a person of one, it should work for a person of a thousand. But it doesn't.

Eric Anthony (31:05):

Yes, the commodity things will scale. No question about that. What I believe doesn't scale is the differences of how the two companies are run. You look at a company of less than a hundred employees and they are run very much, or I should say they consume, they purchase very much like consumers

(31:35):

A thousand plus purchase, like a business they purchase like an enterprise. Now there is that Weebly, wobbly timey wimy group in between from 99 to a thousand. And that is just, it's a weird group. It's hard to know what you're going to get. There's probably some other divisions in there that would be more logical, but you're dealing with a different type of customer and a different type of business at those different levels. And that's what it's very hard to adjust to. That's why so many vendors in the technology space have trouble selling to direct and selling to enterprise customers and selling to small business customers. It's very hard for them to separate those into different sales motions that make sense for the two different sites.

Justin Esgar (32:30):

That's why on all the tool websites, it's like 250 users, $99 a month, 251 plus call us for pricing.

Eric Anthony (32:39):

Yeah, well, that's one of the reasons. Sure. Because they want to make sure that the solution is going to fit and that takes a little extra work, a little extra configuring, plus there's going to be probably some quantity discounts or whatever. But well,

Justin Esgar (32:53):

They also want to make sure that their tool can scale.

Eric Anthony (32:56):

Yes. Well, that is especially true with newer vendors in the space for sure.

Justin Esgar (33:02):

I really wish everybody would just kind of get on the same page with this. Granted, I don't want the me again though. I do feel like, what do we calculate? There's 40,000 MSPs in the United States. We looked this up the other day when we're doing some work that includes these megas. That being said, I'm going to look this up, live

Eric Anthony (33:28):

Time. There's also a lot of one man bands though that are not included in that number or two to three person shops.

Justin Esgar (33:34):

But as of January, 2024, the US Small Business Administration estimates, there are 33.3 million small businesses in the United States. So even if the mega MSPs are part of that 40,000, and let's say even 10 to 20% of that 40,000 is one man shops, one person, two person shops, let's make even numbers. That's 4,000 off. There's still, you're looking at 36,000 MSPs and almost 36 million small businesses. So there's plenty to go around. And those mega MSPs don't even touch the small businesses. So we'll just nix them out of that. Right? So my point here is that if you are afraid that the mega MSP is coming for your guns, sorry, I shouldn't say that. Let me redo that.

Eric Anthony (34:32):

We're not a political

Justin Esgar (34:34):

Podcast. I know you know where I was going. If you're afraid that those mega MSPs are coming for your clients, they're not. They're just there. And you know what? Use them to make, push yourself better. I think that's one thing that a lot of it, and we could talk about this, you and I always go off on rants and we always feel like we come up with 75 new episodes and never talk about it, but we could talk about this. Another one is that we tend to look at competition and curse them out and say like, screw those guys. We're crapping on this one earlier. But use that as, we should really have a conversation about using that as motivation to make yourself better. And I've done that in the past. I have used other MSPs to make myself better, to push me, to make myself better, not just to look better on paper. There's a brain reconfiguration, an optimization if you would, to doing that, right? And if you can think about how instead of cursing out these Meg MSPs who are probably not touching your clients anyway, what are they doing right? Eat that you could mimic to do better with your business. So there's,

Eric Anthony (36:06):

This kind of reminds me of some of the things that come out of the pumpkin plan. And we had Sean Walsh and Dave Kava on several weeks ago on this podcast, still my desk, you have a book right there at your desk line is around here somewhere. But I decided to, because I had actually never listened to the original Pumpkin Plan by Mike Malowitz. And so I listened to it recently. And a lot of what they're saying that you need to do to optimize your business, you can't service all of the different types of clients that are out there with one single business model. It's not optimal. And so according to the pumpkin plan and the way that's supposed to work, you will not achieve maximum profitability, maximum efficiency if you try and be all things to all people, especially when it comes to businesses.

Justin Esgar (37:11):

I was waiting for you to make a joke about being all things through all MSPs. You had it. You were so close,

Eric Anthony (37:17):

But yet so far,

Justin Esgar (37:19):

Well, this is what I find interesting about the difference between an Apple based MSP versus a PC based MSP. Because there are very few Apple consultants that I know that specialize in a niche in a business vertical. But there are a lot of PC firms I know that will namely healthcare care, forgetting the fact that there's not a lot of healthcare on the Mac side. But when it comes to niching on the PC side, I find more PC MSPs having a niche working with one particular vertical. A lot of them, healthcare happens to be the one that I remember a lot of people saying, but there are plenty of others. There's ones who I only do banks or I only do finance or FinTech or whatever on the Mac side. There's probably a handful that I can name. Global Mac does only lawyers, but I've never heard anyone else. I have one ACEs member who specializes in Doctor and dentistry out of San Francisco. Shout out to Steve Ek. But it's not only that, whereas Global Mac and this guy Tom who owns it, only lawyers. So I think the niching thing really is important. I forgot why I was bringing it up, but it was part of it.

Eric Anthony (39:00):

Well, it is a difference, right? And I think

Justin Esgar (39:03):

You're saying it's not all sacks work for all people. That was what it was,

Eric Anthony (39:06):

Right? And I think that just dealing with Max is a niche of it in and of itself.

Justin Esgar (39:15):

It's not. People think that it's not, but that's another conversation for another time. That's three new episodes we came up with today

Eric Anthony (39:26):

And they're all looking forward to every single one of them.

Justin Esgar (39:30):

Are you looking forward to it? Because if you are, leave a review on your favorite podcasting tool. Oh, did you want me to finish closing it out today? Or

Eric Anthony (39:38):

A like, or subscribe or any of those things?

Justin Esgar (39:41):

There we go. Alright. There's a lot happening in the world. I think we'll put a pin in this one. Mega MSPs are not coming for your job. Use them to make yourself better. Figure out your stack. All is well. That's the end of the world.

Eric Anthony (39:56):

Carry on.

Justin Esgar (39:57):

That's the end of the episode, not the end of the world. It's the end of the episode. We started off, we warned you that it was late. We warned you people that it was late when we were recording this. It's now even later and we're probably going to record another one, which is going to be even messier than this one. Check us out at facebook.com/group/all things msp. Maybe post this way. You could be from the group. Thanks, anonymous member. Check us out on youtube.com/at all things MSP to see what it looks like when Eric and Justin go after dark. Follow us on all of your favorite podcasting tools. Leave a review. Tell us that you like us. Tell us you don't like us. Tell us something. It's what we live for. That's how we make our bread. That's Eric. I'm Justin. Bye.

Eric Anthony (40:40):

Thanks for listening and don't forget to subscribe to us on your favorite podcast platform. You can also follow us on Facebook, but better yet, go ahead and join the Facebook group. You can also follow us on Instagram if that's your thing. And make sure you subscribe to our YouTube channel at all things MSP to catch us in all of our video glory. And last but certainly not least, if LinkedIn is your thing, you can follow us there as well. And a special thank you to our premier sponsors, super Ops Move bot go into Easy DM a C and comtech. And we also want to thank our vendor sponsors. The All Things MSP podcast is a biz POW LLC production.